people who go with "almost" no Water Changes needed!

[slavetonet]

Ok.. I have dose in 15ml of potassium nitrate.
Which was mixed from 250g dry powder into 1 Litres of RO Water.
That yield me a 6 ppm of Nitrate in 400 Litres water.
Phosphate still at 0.15 ppm as I am feeding reef roid every night to the corals.
Tomorrow night, I will check the Nitrate and see where it is.
The goal is undetectable phosphate and 2ppm Nitrate.
With my aquarium looking like a jungle at the moment, the algae should die off when the phosphate is stripped out. I will take a before and after photo every day for 1 week.
I believed my water is Nitrogen limited with all in one bio pellets.

 

[glennf]

I wouldn't be surprised to find out that they intentionally put phosphate-rich ingredients in there. The SPS color difference that I got after removing GFO from my tank was insane. I wish that there were a better way to utilize GFO un such a way that it did not either strip nutrients far too low or exhaust extremely fast.

Same experience out here, that's why i keep my nutrients higher than most people intent to (PO= 0,04-0,08ppm).
It depend in the corals you like to keep and how you want the growth and colors to develop.

That's also why i use liquid iron dosing to control phosphate. It's much more controlable, because you control the amount and frequency and the reduced PO4 is predictable and in line with the dosed amount of iron.

Using a solid PO4 remover is fine for most tanks, but you never know when it become saturated. When newly placed it's most effective and in time, when it become more saturated it become less effective. So you get the jojo effect...
Of course you can finetune the use of it , but isn't it with everything.. some people never measure anything, because they have "green fingers", but most people need a reference

 

[tmz]

Without GFO since November , sps in my tanks have richer color. They need some soluble reactive phosphate . IME, PO4 levels of 0.02 to .04ppm ( per hanah 713) are adequate in my system while still low enough to limit nuisance algae;some like it higher.

I don't think liquid iron dosing controls PO4;the binding/adsorbtion occurs with the oxide not the Fe+++; this has more:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-11/rhf/index.htm

 

[mluntz]

I have read this thread from beginning to end and obviously there is no clear answer to this. My question about water changes is this and it may sound stupid, but here goes:

As water evaporates and we top off with RODI, wouldn't that in a way be considered an ongoing water change?

I agree that trace elements need to be kept in check and I believe that WC need to be done occassionally. I used to be in the 10% once a week when the tank was new, but as it matures, I don't think this is necessary as the system stabilizes.

I believe in checking phosphates and nitrates, and changing GFO and carbon as necessary.

 

[tmz]

No ,relacincing evoprated water does not export anything or add anything other than H2O when using RO/di.

 

[morena303]

That depends on how big the tank is and how big and how messy the animals are you have. If you have a tank with some corals and tiny fishes, you don't need to change it often compared to having a very messy octopus or morays which consume a lot of food and generate more waste.

 

[andyman]

Just throwing my data point out there for whatever its worth.

Tank has a total water volume of 130 gallons between the frag tank , sump, and main tank. Tank is also 15 years old. Crashed once about 3-4 years ago due to bubble magus doser failure.

SPS tank with huge colony of ricordia yumas. I have difficulties with Torts but all else grows great including monti's and lokanis.

Water change 30 percent every third month roughly (sometimes longer).

No sandbed, 3 tangs, 1 really big H&S Skimmer with dual A1260 eheim running 18 hours a day. There is an auto top off system. Dose with BRS auto top off with Ca, Mg, and Alk and nothing else. I have a hand full of macro algae in the fuge and a small sand bed also in the fuge.

I recall the tank does a lot better with more frequent water changes but I'm at a point where I don't really want the corals to grow too fast. Other wise I'd have to trim to avoid war between the corals.

 

[glennf]

11,5 years none wc change shedules, just taking control over water parameters with the right tools and still going strong.

Who said a tank without wc will look like a sewer?
Happy Reefing, GlennF.

 

[andyman]

What do you use to maintain params?

 

[glennf]

No waterchanges end up looking like sewer?

Not if you know what you're doing. But how do you know you're doing enough?

11,5 year without wc shedules may say something about impossibility, or plausibly...

Happy Reefing, GlennF.

 

[glennf]

What do you use to maintain params?

All usual macro elements which make a synthetic reefsalt and some trace element i find useful.
I designed a calculator for it, which i use to add minerals which are being depleted.


Happy Reefing, GlennF.

 

[andyman]

Care to share a little more detail? Like which minerals and qty? I know these can be different for different tanks but I'd love to know how you arrived at your formulas and determination of minerals to suppliment. Obviously Alk, CA , and Mg but what about the other stuff?

 

[Horace]

I'm intrigued how u were able to dose the traces when we can't test for most of them. Please share more info on the calc. Do u use a CaRx? That certainly would account for a great deal of traces being replaced

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

 

[glennf]

I'm intrigued how u were able to dose the traces when we can't test for most of them. Please share more info on the calc. Do u use a CaRx? That certainly would account for a great deal of traces being replaced

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Just the common availbale hobby tests.
Nothing else..

CaRx? = Calcium reactor? No i Don't

Happy Reefing, GlennF.

 

[glennf]

Care to share a little more detail? Like which minerals and qty? I know these can be different for different tanks but I'd love to know how you arrived at your formulas and determination of minerals to suppliment. Obviously Alk, CA , and Mg but what about the other stuff?

Does this help...

Happy Reefing, GlennF.

 

[Roadsterron]

Water Changes

Water Changes

I have been dealing in saltwater setups for fish only as well as
Reef tanks.
When it comes to water changes everybody has different time frames which is common.
I have a 93 gallon cube with a heavy load per day. Lots of soft and hard corals. I have found that changing 20 gallons every two weeks gets my job done in good order. I use RO water and a salinity at .026. I have a Reef Octopus skimmer and a powerful Eheim return pump. I keep a .25 phosphate reading which is not harmful. Hardness and calcium are always on the money. I have a filter sock and use Matrix carbon and blue chemi-pure.

I have always believed that letting water changes go is not all that good. The quality of your water defines the quality of your tank!

 

[glennf]

I have been dealing in saltwater setups for fish only as well as
Reef tanks.
When it comes to water changes everybody has different time frames which is common.
I have a 93 gallon cube with a heavy load per day. Lots of soft and hard corals. I have found that changing 20 gallons every two weeks gets my job done in good order. I use RO water and a salinity at .026. I have a Reef Octopus skimmer and a powerful Eheim return pump. I keep a .25 phosphate reading which is not harmful. Hardness and calcium are always on the money. I have a filter sock and use Matrix carbon and blue chemi-pure.

I have always believed that letting water changes go is not all that good. The quality of your water defines the quality of your tank!

How do you define this stocking and quality?
Many still believe it can't be done for a long stretch of time without periodic water changes. This reef is still going just fine for 11,5 years now.

Happy Reefing, GlennF.

 

[BowedFloor]

Does this help...

Happy Reefing, GlennF.

HELLO FRIEND!

I have to say, that is the single most informative graph I have ever seen for this hobby in my life.

I would be quite interested to get my hands on it. Do you obtain your values via test kits, or do you use a water testing service like triton. I'm sorry if you answered this already I'm kinda skipping through the thread.

I also am attempting to go without water changes. I had an issue with nitrates/phosphates on my 230+90g sump. I've since upgraded the skimming, added a sulfur denitrator (Both for nitrate export 'naturally') and I have chaeto attempting to grow in my sump on a 24/7 light schedule. Currently my tank is phosphate limited thankfully. I am using zeovit as well to manage no3/po4. but only the ZeoStart3 stuff. it's a bacteria and a carbon source in one.

Unfortunately due to a bryopsis outbreak due to neglect I lost most of my sps. Had I been doing water changes, even monthly it would have been fine.

So that's my thoughts on no W/C's.

 

[CStrickland]

I have learned a lot from Glenn's info on the "Dutch synthetic reefing" site. It's easy to find on google and if someone wants to go waterchangeless it is a very good place to start learning how; its also just good reading to understand our tanks - there's a ton of wisdom in there.

But it is something you really have to figure out for yourself, in my opinion. This method is not like the zeovit or triton style where you pay for several mysterious potions and if it didn't work it is because you should have bought one more magic bottle. Precision testing is required, as well as the chemistry knowledge to figure out which fertilizer from the hardware store will be safe and raise the particular trace element you need.

It's cool stuff though. Like if people are willing to put in the time to track down his site and learn about the various components they are hugely rewarded. The payoff is a remarkably affordable system with significantly reduced impact on strained water systems. But it's not an easy fix or something you can just go out and buy.

Personally, my favorite part is the money. I don't like how bourgeois some reefers can be. They act snobbish like if you can't afford an expensive controller this isn't the hobby for you. Glenns tank is a good example of what's possible by educating yourself instead of taking expensive shortcuts (livestock might be a different story, but I imagine that he pays for a lot of stuff just with frag selling if he needs too) and the info is free for anybody that is willing to go after it. That's so cool.

 

[glennf]

HELLO FRIEND!

I have to say, that is the single most informative graph I have ever seen for this hobby in my life.

THANKS...

I would be quite interested to get my hands on it. Do you obtain your values via test kits, or do you use a water testing service like triton. I'm sorry if you answered this already I'm kinda skipping through the thread.

TESTKIT OR LABTEST ARE JUST FINE.
ALTHOUGH THE TESTS NEED TO BE PROVEN ACCURATE .
JUS GOOGLE MY NAME...

I also am attempting to go without water changes. I had an issue with nitrates/phosphates on my 230+90g sump. I've since upgraded the skimming, added a sulfur denitrator (Both for nitrate export 'naturally') and I have chaeto attempting to grow in my sump on a 24/7 light schedule. Currently my tank is phosphate limited thankfully. I am using zeovit as well to manage no3/po4. but only the ZeoStart3 stuff. it's a bacteria and a carbon source in one.
IT'S PRETTY SIMPEL
LOWER NO3 WI5H CARBON DOSING
LOWER PO4 WITH IRON DOSING, OR GFO.
YOU NEED BOTH NO3 and PO4 FOR THE CORALS.
I DON'T USE ALGEA OR ANY KIND OF REFUGIUM ATM AND THE SYSTEM IS DOING JUST FINE.

Unfortunately due to a bryopsis outbreak due to neglect I lost most of my sps. Had I been doing water changes, even monthly it would have been fine.
BRYOPSIS IS A REAL PROBLEM TO GET RID IF ONCE YOU HAVE IT IN YOUR TANK. I AM CONDUCTING TEST WITH IT.
NEGLECT IS NEVER OK, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOUR TANK RELY ON THESE WC..
IN DON'T RELY ON WC, BUT TAKE CONTROL OF THE STUFF NEEDED TO CONTROL, BY (AUTO) DOSING THEM..


So that's my thoughts on no W/C's.

Thanks m8

Google "glennf" and you wil find plenty about reef maintenance without wc.
Also look into my tank thread for more pictures.
Nitrate can be controled with carbon dosing
Phophate can be controled with iron dosing And GFO.

Als other element are with minerals you need to make synthetic salts..

HELLO FRIEND!

I have to say, that is the single most informative graph I have ever seen for this hobby in my life.

I would be quite interested to get my hands on it. Do you obtain your values via test kits, or do you use a water testing service like triton. I'm sorry if you answered this already I'm kinda skipping through the thread.

I also am attempting to go without water changes. I had an issue with nitrates/phosphates on my 230+90g sump. I've since upgraded the skimming, added a sulfur denitrator (Both for nitrate export 'naturally') and I have chaeto attempting to grow in my sump on a 24/7 light schedule. Currently my tank is phosphate limited thankfully. I am using zeovit as well to manage no3/po4. but only the ZeoStart3 stuff. it's a bacteria and a carbon source in one.

Unfortunately due to a bryopsis outbreak due to neglect I lost most of my sps. Had I been doing water changes, even monthly it would have been fine.

So that's my thoughts on no W/C's.

HELLO FRIEND!

I have to say, that is the single most informative graph I have ever seen for this hobby in my life.

I would be quite interested to get my hands on it. Do you obtain your values via test kits, or do you use a water testing service like triton. I'm sorry if you answered this already I'm kinda skipping through the thread.

I also am attempting to go without water changes. I had an issue with nitrates/phosphates on my 230+90g sump. I've since upgraded the skimming, added a sulfur denitrator (Both for nitrate export 'naturally') and I have chaeto attempting to grow in my sump on a 24/7 light schedule. Currently my tank is phosphate limited thankfully. I am using zeovit as well to manage no3/po4. but only the ZeoStart3 stuff. it's a bacteria and a carbon source in one.

Unfortunately due to a bryopsis outbreak due to neglect I lost most of my sps. Had I been doing water changes, even monthly it would have been fine.

So that's my thoughts on no W/C's.

Happy Reefing, GlennF.