So you want to open a LFS...

[Opus123]

I guess I really don't see the problem... if you like that fish - he can order you one.

You just put SOLD on the glass... I see it all the time at every fish store I have even been to.

Some people come in on their lunch hour, etc., see a fish they like, buy it and pick it up after work.

I really don't see the problem either. My biggest issue was with a lfs store that would save all the rare stuff for their show tanks. There would be a group of us there when he would get a big shipment in. He literally wouldn't even have to unbag half the order because people would grab them as he pulled them out of the shipping box. It would just make me so mad when he would pull something out and it was rare and he would immediately say he wanted it for his show tank and it wasn't for sale. This was many years ago before "fragging" so really don't see it anymore.

 

[bat21]

the ad before a dori movie is very specific, i by no way recommending a tv ad. Right before a fish movie where no one can fastforward and lights are dimmed. i think it is something to look into. google ad words for a LFS may be excessive.

If i goggle panama city beach saltwater store. Everyone of my LFS comes up. If i want a sps online store i would agree with google ads though.

Search Engine Marketing (SEM) is an integral part of virtually all marketing these days. It is not enough to come up on a long list of results. You need to come up in the top 3 results. There is significant, proven, monetary value in that. Underestimating it's importance is a grave mistake. Thousands upon thousands of people who search google in the state of georgia could see his store at the top of the list.

Making an ad that plays before a children's movie, guarantees nothing and costs so much more money. I'm not saying it wouldn't help at all. I just wouldn't even consider it until I knew I have done everything I can online, where I can focus every cent on the exact type of people I need.

 

[moatdaddy]

I see your point and will concede to your expertise and my lack there of. I didnt see your google results earlier. You are correct in the fact that if i do a google search, top 3 is important. I will however dispute the before the dori movie ad. I wouldnt bring it up in responsible reefing section, shhhh... but i do find the idea worthy of research into cost vs potential gain.

 

[albano]

I guess I really don't see the problem... if you like that fish - he can order you one.

You just put SOLD on the glass... I see it all the time at every fish store I have even been to.

Some people come in on their lunch hour, etc., see a fish they like, buy it and pick it up after work.

The post (IMO) was never about 'special ordered' fish, or buying at lunch hour and picking up a fish later...it was about 'reserving' a fish that was just received, and emailed to multiple people...even if there were pictures, there is no guarantee that people will take the fish once they actually get there to see it.
If the email customer had to pay in advance, like DD, that would be different...money talks!

 

[Salty150]

I see your point and will concede to your expertise and my lack there of. I didnt see your google results earlier. You are correct in the fact that if i do a google search, top 3 is important. I will however dispute the before the dori movie ad. I wouldnt bring it up in responsible reefing section, shhhh... but i do find the idea worthy of research into cost vs potential gain.

To be fair, the vast majority of people you will get with your Google placement are going to already be in the hobby.

The majority of people you would get from the commercial before the new Nemo movie(s) are probably going to be new to the hobby or coming from freshwater to saltwater.

 

[sk8ter20art]

I'm a business owner going on 10 years. Completely different field (if you need printing, shoot me a pm), but a couple things I would very highly recommend to all LFS, speaking from experience.

sk8ter, do you have a steady customer email campaign running? If not you really should. Have customers give you their email. At least once a week send out an email with a list of new fish that have arrived and put your number in a big font that says call now to reserve one of these fish. Ideally, take nice pictures of the more expensive fish. Same goes for new corals that come in, or frags from your growout tank. You have to get in front of your customers eyes. My LFS has taken my email a few times, and I legitimately hoped they would send me emails with weekly sales, or new livestock, so I didn't have to drive there to see what they had. But they are lazy and never send out emails, and then I see the fish I want on Diver's Den and I buy it there. Put your store in front of their face! As often as possible. A salty will not mind a weekly email with pictures of fish and corals that they could own right now if they wanted.

There are plenty of affordable companies that make this very easy, like constant contact. Use that, don't do it on your own. They will have proper unsubscribe links, etc.

And I see in a year you have one review on google for 2 stars. I am a business owner, and we kindly ask our good customers if they wouldn't mind writing us a review on google. THEY ALWAYS SAY YES!!! And so we now have 15-20 5 star reviews that are honest, from the people who appreciate our business and what we offer. I have new customers tell me ALL THE TIME that they saw the great reviews online and gave us a call. This is SO EASY TO DO. You must have happy customers. Just ask them. Don't offer anything in return. Just be honest and say it would help out your business and they will do it in a second.

Lastly, look into google adwords. Without question, this is some of the best money a business can spend. If your store doesn't appear properly in local searches, you're losing tons and tons of business to the stores that advertise with google adwords. I did a search and here is what came up:

Those 3 stores sure look like the places I would go to first. They aren't better than your store, but they just got their customers to write reviews, and they pay for clicks on google searches. Any money you spend on google adwords is either you appearing on a search or someone clicking on your ad. It's not just giving google money. You pay for clicks. You pay for impressions (your ad appearing on the top of a search) for keywords that you choose. You set a monthly budget. Whatever you can afford. The more the better. There are also companies that can manage your adwords account for you since it can be slightly complicated. Reach Local is who I use. It was clear as day the increase in phonecalls when we started using adwords. I cannot recommend this enough. Use it use it use it.

These are really super easy ways to help get customers in your store. Word of mouth is great, but you have so many other ways to reach customers nowadays that businesses do not take advantage of.

I see your point on email marketing and more on google. I hadnt seen that google review till now, do not remember that person at my shop (could have been a day i wasnt there). I hate when people give low star reviews and cant take the time to write why, or it could have been an accident. All of our facebook reviews are 5 stars, and there are plenty that give a description of what they like about us.

Yes those three stores you posted are great stores ( there are more than 3 great stores), but they are 2hrs north of mine and have owners that have been in the hobby 20+ years. Those shops are in atlanta which has a lot more people with a lot higher disposable income, and a larger established customer base. The reason i opened up shop is because the general pet stores in my area were severly lacking in the saltwater dept. Driving to atlanta is a headache due to traffic and ends up bieng a whole day event. We do not have any petcos in our area, only petsmart and they do not sell saltwater livestock.

If you narrow it down to a 30mile radius our store is at the top for fish/coral. There is only one other store that sells primarily fish but they focus on freshwater, and are slowly turning into a general pet store with reptiles.

As far as advertising we have done radio ads that brought in new business (no cost to make or change an ad) only cost is to run it. The tv ad is to get people who are interested in the hobby but dont know where to start or that we are here. There is also going to be some digital advertising tied in with the tv ad, through apps and certain webpages. Im gonna see abouth the theatre ad space to see what it cost.

A majority of our customers are new to the hobby so they are still learning. There are only a few veterans in this area, they heard about us before we actually opened the doors. People that are really into the hobby will shop hop anyways.

We do special order fish for people. If its a common fish thats easy to sell we will order it, if its rare/expensive or extremely difficult we will ask for a deposit. We QT all fish for 2 weeks, we do allow people to view our QT system so people get a chance to see them before they get sold/picked up. We ask to hold special order fish for at least 1 week, and if the customer doesnt want to wait they can purchase it but they assume all the risk.

I think knowing your customer base is the biggest factor in choosing advertising. Not everyone is online, on facebook, etc so you have to rely on classic methods like radio and tv. We looked into a billboard but the cost was pretty high for what you get.

I definitely see we need to ask for some more reliable google reviews. I am also going to look into the one we did get. I have heard its PITA to get false reviews removed. I used to work at a hotel and i got to read the customer surveys/reviews. Doing that i learned that you have to ignore the high and low extremes, because somebody that knows a lot or has seen a lot may have a higher standard than someone who is the opposite, but the key is where is the middle average, that will give you a true review.

Some places get there friends/family to write amazing reviews to fluff up there numbers.

I learned a lot if what i know because of reefcentral and the knowledge base it has. And now that i have a shop my experience level has been on fast forward in dealing with fish/corals/inverts. Some things are hard to learn till you run into it. Like how to deal with different diseases, fish compatability, properly sizing equipment for a setup. Learning the difference between multiple brands. Now i also have contacts with some of the top people in this industry and get to learn tips and tricks from them.

Well this post is getting a bit long so im gonna cut it off here.

 

[bat21]

Forget trying to fix that review. The only thing you can do is cover it up with a dozen 5 star reviews. So get working on that.

I'm not trying to tell you anything about your customer base. I'm simply trying to give you very modern marketing techniques. Tv/radio/billboards are outdated methods of how companies used to reach people. Saying not everyone is online is like saying you only want to market to people who are over 60 years old. People find things on google. Plain and simple. The entire population of people who spend money on things use google to find those things. Are there exceptions? Yep, as in all cases. But they should be ignored.

You say your methods are an attempt to get people into the hobby. Ok, that is one way to do things. My methods are targeting people who are either ALREADY IN or WANT TO BE IN the hobby. And they are inexpensive, but extremely targeted and effective. You are free to do whatever you want. But please please please look into search engine marketing and google adwords. I understand what it is like to own a small business. After 10 years, I have learned, without a doubt, this is the most important marketing money you can spend. I simply cannot stress this enough. This will be my last post on the subject. I wish you the best of luck and am only trying to help. It's a tough road out there for small businesses.

Just call the company Reach Local. They can put together a trial run of adwords for you. They will show you your statistics of how many searches you came up in. How many clicks you got. How many phonecalls you got directly from the campaign. And if you are seeing no increase in traffic, then you can simply cancel it and move on. It's literally zero risk.

 

[Halo_003]

Forget trying to fix that review. The only thing you can do is cover it up with a dozen 5 star reviews. So get working on that.

I'm not trying to tell you anything about your customer base. I'm simply trying to give you very modern marketing techniques. Tv/radio/billboards are outdated methods of how companies used to reach people. Saying not everyone is online is like saying you only want to market to people who are over 60 years old. People find things on google. Plain and simple. The entire population of people who spend money on things use google to find those things. Are there exceptions? Yep, as in all cases. But they should be ignored.

You say your methods are an attempt to get people into the hobby. Ok, that is one way to do things. My methods are targeting people who are either ALREADY IN or WANT TO BE IN the hobby. And they are inexpensive, but extremely targeted and effective. You are free to do whatever you want. But please please please look into search engine marketing and google adwords. I understand what it is like to own a small business. After 10 years, I have learned, without a doubt, this is the most important marketing money you can spend. I simply cannot stress this enough. This will be my last post on the subject. I wish you the best of luck and am only trying to help. It's a tough road out there for small businesses.

Just call the company Reach Local. They can put together a trial run of adwords for you. They will show you your statistics of how many searches you came up in. How many clicks you got. How many phonecalls you got directly from the campaign. And if you are seeing no increase in traffic, then you can simply cancel it and move on. It's literally zero risk.

Business student and semi new (<3yrs) reef keeper here, I absolutely agree with all of this. TV/Radio/phonebook (IMO as a 22yr old), is just wasting money, I don't watch TV live, only on DVR when I can fast forward through commercials. I do listen to radio when driving, but flip stations when commercials run. Your online presence is the really key thing, again IMO.

I've moved around a few times, and each time I have Googled for fish stores and only found about half of them in the new area. It could be weeks or months before I actually find out about the others that didn't come up on Google. For someone like me at least, not having an online presence means I may never find your store at all. I generally try to hit all the stores in my area for different things, some I like better for dry goods, others for plumbing parts, and maybe another for corals.

I do agree the email list is a great idea, even once a week saying "hey we got these (XYZ) fish in today, drop in to check them out!", I always check the Divers Den updates, it is a tactic that works for me at least to get me checking every day or so. None of the stores in my area do this, and I feel they miss out big time by doing that. Unrelated note: I also agree with what was stated earlier in the thread, I prefer a clear price on everything in the store.

Just my $.02, hope it helps as a younger reef keepers perspective.

 

[mhucasey]

I see your point on email marketing and more on google. I hadnt seen that google review till now, do not remember that person at my shop (could have been a day i wasnt there). I hate when people give low star reviews and cant take the time to write why, or it could have been an accident. All of our facebook reviews are 5 stars, and there are plenty that give a description of what they like about us.

Yes those three stores you posted are great stores ( there are more than 3 great stores), but they are 2hrs north of mine and have owners that have been in the hobby 20+ years. Those shops are in atlanta which has a lot more people with a lot higher disposable income, and a larger established customer base. The reason i opened up shop is because the general pet stores in my area were severly lacking in the saltwater dept. Driving to atlanta is a headache due to traffic and ends up bieng a whole day event. We do not have any petcos in our area, only petsmart and they do not sell saltwater livestock.

If you narrow it down to a 30mile radius our store is at the top for fish/coral. There is only one other store that sells primarily fish but they focus on freshwater, and are slowly turning into a general pet store with reptiles.

As far as advertising we have done radio ads that brought in new business (no cost to make or change an ad) only cost is to run it. The tv ad is to get people who are interested in the hobby but dont know where to start or that we are here. There is also going to be some digital advertising tied in with the tv ad, through apps and certain webpages. Im gonna see abouth the theatre ad space to see what it cost.

A majority of our customers are new to the hobby so they are still learning. There are only a few veterans in this area, they heard about us before we actually opened the doors. People that are really into the hobby will shop hop anyways.

We do special order fish for people. If its a common fish thats easy to sell we will order it, if its rare/expensive or extremely difficult we will ask for a deposit. We QT all fish for 2 weeks, we do allow people to view our QT system so people get a chance to see them before they get sold/picked up. We ask to hold special order fish for at least 1 week, and if the customer doesnt want to wait they can purchase it but they assume all the risk.

I think knowing your customer base is the biggest factor in choosing advertising. Not everyone is online, on facebook, etc so you have to rely on classic methods like radio and tv. We looked into a billboard but the cost was pretty high for what you get.

I definitely see we need to ask for some more reliable google reviews. I am also going to look into the one we did get. I have heard its PITA to get false reviews removed. I used to work at a hotel and i got to read the customer surveys/reviews. Doing that i learned that you have to ignore the high and low extremes, because somebody that knows a lot or has seen a lot may have a higher standard than someone who is the opposite, but the key is where is the middle average, that will give you a true review.

Some places get there friends/family to write amazing reviews to fluff up there numbers.

I learned a lot if what i know because of reefcentral and the knowledge base it has. And now that i have a shop my experience level has been on fast forward in dealing with fish/corals/inverts. Some things are hard to learn till you run into it. Like how to deal with different diseases, fish compatability, properly sizing equipment for a setup. Learning the difference between multiple brands. Now i also have contacts with some of the top people in this industry and get to learn tips and tricks from them.

Well this post is getting a bit long so im gonna cut it off here.

I'm in my 40's and when I need to find something I use Google - I don't respond to TV or Radio ads or even online ads.

Having a Facebook page seems like a popular way to go for businesses these days but in my opinion, that needs to be in addition to a solid webpage.
I find Facebook to be horrible for business purposes. I want to find out your hours, phone number, what kind of stuff you stock, and where you are without wading through FB posts.

A simple, inexpensive webpage will give you those things, as will proper representation on Google. Don't add more content to a webpage than that unless you can keep it updated. Out of date info is almost as bad as no info.

 

[Salty150]

...keep it updated. Out of date info is almost as bad as no info.

++++1

 

[atreis]

I'm in my 40's and when I need to find something I use Google - I don't respond to TV or Radio ads or even online ads.

Having a Facebook page seems like a popular way to go for businesses these days but in my opinion, that needs to be in addition to a solid webpage.
I find Facebook to be horrible for business purposes. I want to find out your hours, phone number, what kind of stuff you stock, and where you are without wading through FB posts.

A simple, inexpensive webpage will give you those things, as will proper representation on Google. Don't add more content to a webpage than that unless you can keep it updated. Out of date info is almost as bad as no info.

Same here. I'm in my 40s and mostly listen to my own music collection in the car. If I do listen to the radio, it's NPR. I watch almost no TV (~1 hour a week on average) and stream movies from Netflix.

I don't use, and don't want to use, Facebook or Twitter. If you use Facebook to reach the people that DO use it, please also keep in mind that there are a lot of people that don't, and don't want to. You need to have the same information on a normal web site also. Design the website for a PC as well as phone. These days, some companies have started to neglect full size PC (non-touch) displays and have created sites that are very difficult to use on full size screens with a mouse. (Some car companies seem especially bad about this.) Also make it usable from a phone. You really need both today.

Email updates are appreciated. I sign up for email from vendors I like all the time. If I tire of them, they go to spam and that's that. It's very easy, so that's my preferred way to get ads. Don't require clicking on a link in the email to see some crucial piece of information - I and others that are security-conscious never click on links in emails. Also, include any images within the email (you can do this using separate Mime types in a single email body) so that one doesn't have to open up another security hole to download images associated with the email. (If you can't figure that out, at least include in the text of the email what the image is of so that I can decide whether I want to go to your website and see the details. Again - I don't click links or download images that aren't part of the email body - if I want more info, I hit the company's website. That said, I'm probably more security-conscious and careful than most. )

Wherever you put your online information, keep it updated please. Only put information out there that you are willing to update. If you keep stock lists online, that's great, but only if it's accurate. It's better to not have it online than for it to be there but out of date.

 

[PIPSTER]

My not-so-local fish store has their act together.
They make their majority of profit on service, so they are open Wed-Sat. at their store.
They have clean, big acrylic tanks, all top-line led lighting, are always working, have the answers, don't have employees so they are in-touch, and qt their fish and livestock.

My only whine with them is they know they are the only LFS for miles around, so their livestock prices are higher than I can get online INCLUDING shipping, so I've not bought everything I have from them.
They have basic supplies, but are equipment savvy enough to know better than to stock up on just dry goods. They look for used tanks to clean up and sell. They know people are looking for deals, so they do packages. They discount frags if you buy multiple polyps.
They can order what you want for fish, but not so much for coral, so they're kinda at a disadvantage there...but they don't sell brown, ugly coral, either, it's top stuff.

IMO, if it's a low-margin business, it better be high volume to succeed.
I think if you're selling coral you would do better to be price competitive and sell more coral volume, than just sell a few pieces for $150 that everyone else is selling for $50.

 

[sk8ter20art]

Ok well here is a update. Asked our customers to please post reviews on google, we got several new reviews (all 5 stars, with comments). Waiting on a verification letter from google so i can edit our google profile and add pics etc, respond to reviews. Not really sure why or how we got a 2 star review as we have no transaction under that name.

We mainly use facebook to post new arrivals, available, etc. I still have a full time job with a rotating schedule so i rarely have access to an actual computer. So most of my posting, emailing is all done from my phone. Which limits some capabilities. We do have a website with basic store info. Store hrs, phone, etc are all kept up to date.

Since my shop is in a new market area we have a lot of beginners and first time hobbyists. In any business your repeat customers are the ones that help keep the doors open. They come in once a week and buy something or look for something to buy. Most people that have been doing it a long time have most of there equipment they want, tank full of fish/coral. So while they might spend more on a single item, they dont come in as often. Also a lot of our first time reefers buy pre-mixed saltwater and ro/di topoff water. As they learn they upgrade to there own unit, but it gets them started, and gets them in the store more frequently.

The biggest thing we are trying to do is get our name out there, word of mouth is big market too. So we have done radio, working on tv, and improving our web presence as well. We even have a few petsmart employees that refer people to our store.

We do have a few service contracts going so far, but not as many as we need. If i am up there on a day we are closed or after hrs and someone pulls up, i have no problem letting them in, especially if its there first visit. Ive made several sales on days where i was only up there about 30mins.

We also do tank drilling and some acrylic work as well. Those are things none of our competitors offer. So we are even getting business from tanks people have bought through craigslist that were not reef ready. I am a big DIY person and have built a lot of things tank related, each time i do, i learn something new either what works/doesnt work.

And as always i appreciate input from members of reefcentral. I learned a lot here reading through the many posts in "new to the hobby". I know there are a lot of very knowledgeable people here and appreciate that they share there knowledge and experience. I am still learning new stuff every day. :thumbsup: i also share my knowledge with several facebook reef groups as well.

 

[Salty150]

...and qt their fish and livestock.

...so their livestock prices are higher than I can get online INCLUDING shipping, so I've not bought everything I have from them.

Am I the only one to see the irony in these two statements?

 

[Reef Frog]

In addition to maintenance, these areas may provide a local retailer a profit center. Ideas are based on what I do not often see in LFSs I visit:

Bulk consumables. Kalk, 2 part solution, GFO, salt, & perhaps GAC can be purchased in bulk and sold in consumer quantities. Have signage comparing the savings over the name brand products.

Let's not forget selling RODI water & prepared salt water.

Frozen & live food. Often, the shipping & packing costs make the on line vendors pricing non competitive with a local vendor. Live food has the same advantage for the LFS & in some cases be cultured in house, and may attract a higher end clientele.

In my area, no one is any good at selling big first class (non AIO) tanks. The sales process is pathetic. Maybe a dusty Marineland 75g or 90 in stock, but no appealing demo models of what you may want to buy. They flip thru a few paper catalogs with their thumb on the wholesale price. Very few definitive answers. Bean animal, coast to coast overflow? They might think that's a Beach Boys song. Jeez, not all of us want to order & be shipped a tank from 2000 miles away sight unseen. And not everyone relishes doing drilling & PVC plumbing, handling enormous weights or building or assembling stands etc. It seems easy enough to have some 3,4,5,6 & 8 foot options (width) on display and a price sheet that makes sense if it all. Have a standardized package for each size range. Many customers realize the daunting nature of putting this all together themselves and might willingly allow you a decent profit martini them. You could then sign up for a wholesale account at MD OR BRS and get a small piece of the action on light fixtures, skimmer & fancy pumps etc without having to stock them. Unless you have a local store in the area already who is really good at this, the consumers' options on line are limited &'take enormous effort to source & implement. You now have the opportunity to offer a set up & cycling service. Advantage local guy if done well.

 

[Ou8me2]

The problem with google reviews and even really most types of review sites you don't even have to prove you were a customer. Anyone can write a review on google and never stepped foot into your store. It could be a competitor who convinced one of his friends or whoever to write a poor review.

You really don't need to hire a service for adwords or even search engine rankings, but I will say it takes a lot of time reading to learn the ropes. So if time is short, then maybe it might be best to hire someone. I honestly think Tv ads would be a huge waste cause most people skip the ads these days. Word of mouth is the best advertising by far and the most cost effective.

Heck, I'd even suggest doing a radio station ad or even a remote broadcast with a local radio station. Get people to come to the store and see what you have to offer. This is a way to show off your store and get people talking or interested in the hobby. Even if people don't get into the hobby, they may be in a conversation at another time and say "Hey, There is a great looking store at this location" Again, just getting someone to step in and see what you have to offer could make them a customer.


Facebook is a great tool, but don't just make a page and post something every once in a blue-moon. Post new arrivals, let people know of sales/new products and make it interactive.

 

[bat21]

Good work on the reviews. The same thing happened to me. We got a 1 star review, from a person who was definitely talking about another store with the same name. Google refused to do anything about it, so we demolished that bad review with years and years of glowing reviews. We have people all the time mention how we have such amazing reviews. It definitely helps. Don't stop now. Keep asking every good customer you have.

And I can't help myself from mentioning it again. Adwords. Adwords. Adwords. Beginners will search google to find a fish store. People don't see a commercial and decide to get a fish tank. They already have the inclination. You want to come up when they search for the place to buy their first tank. Or come up in a search for tank maintenance. The return on investment of a good adwords campaign will be a million times better than a tv commercial. It is always running. Always working for you. Always putting your store in front of the right eyes.

 

[Jeff4777]

While I never plan to open a "LFS" I really enjoyed reading this thread. Good stuff and I hope some already LFS owners read this and re think somethings. .

 

[Piper27]

If you own a LFS....

Do not put "grow out" corals mixed in with all the for sales. No one wants to spend hours looking Nd then find out every purchase wanted is for them to "grow" out. Honestly I have never seen anything grow in a LFS near me.

Pull sick fish and treat them.

Flush dead fish... NOW! Not when your done with this and that and five good customers have seen them and decide not to buy because of it.

Order new corals. I haven't seen a single new coral in a store near me for over a year.

I could go on and on but it doesn't help where I live. I have asked for places to order things and it never happens. That combined with no new coral, I don't visit LFS anymore unless it's an emergency.

 

[that Fish Guy]

The LFS in my area are awesome. 1 guy has his house connect to a downtown retail space. Knows his stuff and imports the good stuff and the cheap stuff. He knows after 3 years I'm not his key customer. I buy it rarely dies. I don't need special x of fancy z. Where his store struggles is in dry goods. I go there and spend good money on livestock.

But I can't spend 80$ on a box of salt when I can get it for 50 online without tax. I wanted an ati unit and he couldn't even get it from his wholesaler cheaper than BRS. He was ****ed. I honestly feel bad for him. Non livestock has been online nickled and dimed into a buyers dream. To be honest I don't know how even carrying that stuff can be worth it. I would stock minimum emergency supplies and post a pictured price list or tablet with pictures for dry goods at 5% mark up. Let's be honest we don't need to physically see things in a store to buy them anymore. My point is a LFS owner should not pin there profits on dry goods.

Service and maintenance is good for LFS and restaurants, doctor offices and retail stores will drive bottom line IMO. Those accounts drive consistent revenue assuming the LFS maintains them well.

Almost every single LFS I have been in within the last 20+ years I have been going has no prices to go with livestock. Recently I have been seeing plastic colorful dividers, someone at macna had them. Those are a godsend. Put a little sign on a frag plug 15$ section. Then border the group of frags. Fish I don't have a good solution but I'm sure someone does.

OP posted about signs. I also like that idea and rarely see it. As mentioned earlier some people are flat out not social. Others are always right and your way is wrong. Help these people along by posting some policies and offers. You never know what someone may have decided why you were dealing with the old veteran that keeps talking.

Which moves me to my other LFS. Matt has half coral shop. Other half car repair. No joke. First time in asked if fumes were an issue and he responded well. Obvious not the first to ask but he segerated the building properly. My point is matt is on point. Excellent coral and fish. He is not a first time buyer kind of seller. Low dry good inventory. Mostly high end corals. A moderate fish selection. Why is he successful? IMO because of the car repair business. I drive 3-4 depending on traffic round trip to see him, so not often. But I will occassionaly because he does everything right. Awesome display tank. Grows and frags his own stuff too. Healthy fish. Clean store. Notes on stuff in stock. Non pushy sales.

I would love to own a LFS but never will. I would rather open an aquarium and charge people to enter. Where i help corals and fish not just live but thrive. Yet I'm a rationalist. That's silly amounts of money and normally an endeavor done by who knows. So I will grow my corals and play finger games with my fish. Don't judge, you do it too. Maybe I can sell some frags and recoup some cost or buy some new all in one testing device.

To those who strive and put forward the long hours in the hopes of making your passion a wholesome occupation I salute you and wish you luck.

If your LFS cannot get something Cheaper than BRS they are doing something wrong and need a new Wholesaler.

Getting them to Match or come Close to BRS is a Different Story.

But don't tell me you can't buy it WHOLESALE Cheaper than BRS Sells it for.

He must be Lying to You about that.