Splitting Carpet Anemonies
- Thread starter ilvfsh
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dave willmore
New member
Hey folks, I just found this thread and enjoyed the entertaining read. I am readying a 3,500 gallon "plankton system" to try and culture planktonic larvae like this anemone species. It will not be ready for at least a few months but if some anemone experts are willing to help guide the experiment we might learn something. At least it would be worth a try.
Are you hoping to put anemones in it that will spawn naturally, or are you somehow going to try to collect fertilized eggs or larvae themselves?
dave willmore
New member
Why not make batches by running broodstock through a blender?
Actually I'm a believer that the water quality in the broodstock tank is best for larvae. If mommy and daddy eat junior and his sisters my plan is to float larval btrays in the broodstock tank with screened bottoms for more stable water parameters and drip live food into the buckets.
I can start by any number of methods. If anyone has fertilized eggs I offer gratitude and cash. I assume that I will collect a bunch of anemones and acclimitize them. Spawning in response to stress is common, but my last resort. I'm a believer that high quality larvae are the best chance of success and are only obtained from fat and happy broodstock.
Running broodstock through a blender? Is that a joke?
What anemones are you specifically referring to? Spawning of the big carpets is not that common.
What anemones are you specifically referring to? Spawning of the big carpets is not that common.
dave willmore
New member
Yes it is a joke! Killing animals is not my idea of fun.
I think carpet spawning could occur more often if their environment more closely duplicated ocean conditions. I see most reef animals as plankton filter feeders so I've designed a tank that keeps plankton alive until it eaten by a polyp. It may not work but my intuition is that it may be an improvement over current methods.
Too bad that spawning is rare, perhaps more animals and healthier care can increase my chances. Carpets probably release pheromones as mass spawning cues so having more animals probably worth a try. I'm open to any advice.
I think carpet spawning could occur more often if their environment more closely duplicated ocean conditions. I see most reef animals as plankton filter feeders so I've designed a tank that keeps plankton alive until it eaten by a polyp. It may not work but my intuition is that it may be an improvement over current methods.
Too bad that spawning is rare, perhaps more animals and healthier care can increase my chances. Carpets probably release pheromones as mass spawning cues so having more animals probably worth a try. I'm open to any advice.
ousnakebyte
New member
Hi Dave - I got your PM - email me when you get a chance.
I have many thoughts on this - definitely not running parents through blenders though...
Breeding anemones in captivity is possible - I believe - but it's going to take some work, and probably a little luck. I've been able to successfully raise two different species of pacific northwest anemones from larvae (almost two years old now), and I believe these same techniques can be applied to tropical anemones.
No one I know is going to have fertilized eggs, so we are going to have to get the anemones to sychronize spawning - this, as well as getting enough healthy KNOWN males and females - is going to be the biggest challenge. I don't think you can non-invasively tell boys from girls until they actually release spawn.
I would also favor working with S. haddoni first - as these are probably a little hardier than giganteas and probably more readily available.
I think stress spawning is also probably the best bet to get the anemones to spawn, as this is what I think triggered spawning of my coldwater anemones. And, none of them died - it was triggered by a move from QT to display.
I've also had my blue S. haddoni at home release eggs several times after a move or a tank "rearrangement." And, it's no worse for the wear.
Anyway, these are just some initial thoughts. I have larval rearing tank designs that are very easily fabricated, and I also just used static bins for holding developing larvae for a few days. In the end, my larval anemones ended up settling/metamorphosing on glass walls and are easly moved with a careful fingernail touch.
So... those are some initial thoughts. Equipment such as stereoscopes will be nice to document developing larvae as well.
Cheers
Mike
dave willmore
New member
Mike, thanks for the great response. Although carpets are expensive, so is time. I think it would be easier to start with a dozen animals. If they don't respond to normal spawning cues (good health, temp fluctuation, dylight length, full moon) I'm fine with stress manipulation. Whatever works.
dave willmore
New member
Also, why not start with multiple species, as long as they don't engage in chemical warfare. I can divide the system if chemical battles create problems. The first species that responds to spawning cues is where the work starts.
I'm good at the hard work, I'm not so good at the luck part. I have 4,000 gallons of culture area in sumps beneath the display area to culture live food. Spawning broodstock usually isn't the bottleneck, first food and larval nutrition end up being deal killers.
I'm good at the hard work, I'm not so good at the luck part. I have 4,000 gallons of culture area in sumps beneath the display area to culture live food. Spawning broodstock usually isn't the bottleneck, first food and larval nutrition end up being deal killers.
Ok, I wanted to be sure because that is a method that has been proposed for other inverts, such as sponges.
While some folks do keep multiple large anemone species, the experiences of some of us, myself included, tend to indicate that they may irritate one another somehow and anemones that have been in one place for years have released from the bottom when a new species is introduced.
dave willmore
New member
Ok, I wanted to be sure because that is a method that has been proposed for other inverts, such as sponges.
Because we haven't conversed before, you didn't know my wacky sense of humor. My bad. Next time I'll use a smiley face to indicate the joke.
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dave willmore
New member
You're right, I have read of this common occurrance. Part of me hopes that 3,500 gallons will dilute the chemical toxins to lessen this factor. The more rational part of me thinks that I should divide the system into two or more. This will not be easy because the tank wraps around the perimeter of a 400 square foot greenhouse, but it could be done.
Another part of my little brain says stick with gigantea. My father used to advise "it is just as easy to be hung for stealing a sheep as it is to be hung for stealing a goat". The modern equivalent of this would be "go big or go home".
That said, I am not a big risk taker so the idea of moving on mulitple species has more logic than setting up the entire system for one species and then waiting years for a spawn. Not much entertainment in wasting all that time. And if I split the system, I could add some of the other large carpets also and perhaps work with half a dozen species. The probability of spawning would go way up.
dave willmore
New member
I don't have access to a stereoscope, just a secondhand microscope. A stereoscope would be incredibly useful. Otherwise I'd be guessing at the mouth gape and feeding mechanism, then feeding calanoid copepod larvae and squishing the larvae flat on a slide under the scope to see if the gut was full. Not very scientific or proper, but it gets the job done. Another favorite poor boy method is to use a 10x or greater hand lens and lean against the side of the tank for a long time while larvae swim in and out of the field of focus. A little eye strain never hurt anyone.
its been close to a year now, i sold the other half a few months back but here is my half from the other day. WIll try to get a recent pic of the other half from the buyer. I also have progess shots along the way which when i have time can post up.
I have also repeated with a different specimen approx 6 months ago with similar success.
I am in contact with a marine biologist and we going to do a certified experiment in a lab with scientific approved methods/controls and have results published in a journal of some sort.
I have also repeated with a different specimen approx 6 months ago with similar success.
I am in contact with a marine biologist and we going to do a certified experiment in a lab with scientific approved methods/controls and have results published in a journal of some sort.
BonsaiNut
Premium Member
LOL!
Ryan PLEASE stop posting random photos of gigantea closeups when you've been telling us for months ago all the things you are "going" to do. JUST DO THEM and stop telling us about it!
You currently have ZERO credibility in this forum. Show some of the things you SAY you have you done, or else go away. It's really not doing anything for your reputation.
As far as your "marine biologist" statement goes, it makes NO SENSE. What, exactly, are you going to study? What "approved methods" are you going to test? What "controls" are you going to use? You are babbling and just giving yourself a bad reputation. Stop while you're behind - no one is asking you to make up these stories.
I too can post closeups of gigantea tentacles. What does it mean? NOTHING!
Ryan PLEASE stop posting random photos of gigantea closeups when you've been telling us for months ago all the things you are "going" to do. JUST DO THEM and stop telling us about it!
You currently have ZERO credibility in this forum. Show some of the things you SAY you have you done, or else go away. It's really not doing anything for your reputation.
As far as your "marine biologist" statement goes, it makes NO SENSE. What, exactly, are you going to study? What "approved methods" are you going to test? What "controls" are you going to use? You are babbling and just giving yourself a bad reputation. Stop while you're behind - no one is asking you to make up these stories.
I too can post closeups of gigantea tentacles. What does it mean? NOTHING!
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ousnakebyte
New member
I asked these questions on... page 2 or 3, I think it was - or thereabouts. I was told they are industrial, money-making secrets... that will eventually be published.
PLEASE, anyone following this thread - DO NOT cut your carpet anemone(s). At least, not until we can follow this scientific study and read the paper...
Mike
BonsaiNut
Premium Member
Hey Mike, check it out.
Here's a photo of my dog that I reproduced by cutting in half.
it's been close to a year now, i sold the other half a few months back but here is my half from the other day. WIll try to get a recent pic of the other half from the buyer. I also have progess shots along the way which when i have time can post up.
I have also repeated with a different specimen approx 6 months ago with similar success.
I am in contact with a veterinarian and we going to do a certified experiment in a lab with scientific approved methods/controls and have results published in a journal of some sort.
