SPS and Water Parameters

[Omie]

How is the extra feeding going? Are you seeing positive results on the SPS? I expect you should see better colours starting to appear and less brown etc.

Thanks for asking!
It's been 9 days since my last post, and I've had some changes (you guys will be my judges).

I'm still feeding the tank daily, but small changes were made. Instead of feeding 3 times per day, I've changed to 2 times per day. I thought 3 times per day was too much in a small period of time. Also, I'm having lots of brown hair algae on the back glass. I'm feeding the tank at night with oyster fest and during the day, I feed pellets for the fish.

The lights have been increased from 50% to 60% of intensity and still running for 4.5 hours daylight. So far the corals are responding good and the encreasement of the light intensity will keep going to 75%.

This is the before and after pic of my Garf Bonsai. In person, it looks more purple than the pic. I never expected that the changes could be this fast, but I won't complain.

1/5/16
<a href="http://s1014.photobucket.com/user/omie11/media/reef%20central/27E9BC3B-82D4-45DD-9C8F-C04377F0F816.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af269/omie11/reef%20central/27E9BC3B-82D4-45DD-9C8F-C04377F0F816.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 27E9BC3B-82D4-45DD-9C8F-C04377F0F816.jpg"/></a>

1/14/16
<a href="http://s1014.photobucket.com/user/omie11/media/reef%20central/IMG_2796.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af269/omie11/reef%20central/IMG_2796.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_2796.jpg"/></a>


My water parameters:
Salt: 1.025
Temp: 77.4
Alk: 8.0dKh
Ca: 390ppm
Mag: 1650ppm
Nitrate: 0ppm
PO4: 0ppm
Ph: 7.80

Still no signs or symptoms of nitrates or P04. But now I need to clean my glass daily, and back flow and the back glass is getting more brown hair algae.

 

[alten78]

Definitely try to get some detectable amount of nitrate, that's when I saw the most changes. I still feed heavy, turn off the skimmer half of the time, and cut back on water changes, I still don't see po4 on the hanna but I'm sure it has to be there but no3 is steady without needing to dose anymore potassium nitrate. I'm needing to clean the glass daily and getting a lot of brown algae as well, but colors are better than they ever have been.

I'll get back to cleaning things up and not looking so dingy, but it just goes to show that sometimes we might think there is excess nutrients when in reality there isn't enough or the balance of import/export is off.

Good luck, I'm sure things will start looking better soon!

 

[danrobberg]

I'm dosing nopox and have undetectable nitrates and phosphates on the lowest readable amount on Red Sea test kits. I run gac and poly filter. I just added my first few frags within the last few days. I'm worried my levels might be to low. I cut back on the nopox and am dosing 4ml every day for a little over 100 gallon total volume. I feed 1 cube of brine to four small fish daily. Half cube in morning half in evening.

 

[PederP]

I'm dosing nopox and have undetectable nitrates and phosphates on the lowest readable amount on Red Sea test kits. I run gac and poly filter. I just added my first few frags within the last few days. I'm worried my levels might be to low. I cut back on the nopox and am dosing 4ml every day for a little over 100 gallon total volume. I feed 1 cube of brine to four small fish daily. Half cube in morning half in evening.

From my experience, cutting down on your removal until you get a NO3 reading of 2-5ppm and PO4 between 0,01 and 0,03 is a good target for strong color.
Tried using poly years back. I don't like it. To me it appears it does something similar to activated carbon. Way to clean water for my sps. I keep some AC as a backup if something goes wrong, but never use it.

What lights do you use?

I have a lot of uptake. Today my 240 gets 5-10 cubes a day + lettuce, dried flakes, reefpearls etc., and i still ad 2ml sangokai NPK to keep my values above 0.

Its my personal experiences. I see beautiful tanks running with 0 nutrients every day, but that just wont work for me..

 

[danrobberg]

I use the ghl Mitras 6200 led light pendant.

 

[PederP]

I use the ghl Mitras 6200 led light pendant.

I asked the question because I find the consumption related to the output of my led. To some degree symptoms on coral and levels of nutrient, can be counteracted by the output.
High output and low nutrients spells disaster in my led tank. The t5 tank hooked up to the same system doesn't struggle the same way during periods of lower nutrients.

The Mitras is the #1 led in my book, but very powerful

 

[dr.dator]

SPS and Water Parameters

From my experience, if you are not feeding your corals, too little no3 and po4 is worse than too much. If the corals are fed properly then they are not as dependent on their symbiotic algae (zooxanthellae) for nutrients. Thus no3 and po4 can be lower without harming the coral. High no3 and po4 will increase zooxanthellae which will make the corals look brown because the algae masks the corals true colors.

High levels of organics/food and reasonably low no3/po4 (but not zero) is the recipe for success IMO.

Here is a recent photo of my tank. No3 around 5 and po4 0.08. I'm feeding heavily with reef roids, zoplan, mysis etc.

 

[Omie]

Definitely try to get some detectable amount of nitrate, that's when I saw the most changes. I still feed heavy, turn off the skimmer half of the time, and cut back on water changes, I still don't see po4 on the hanna but I'm sure it has to be there but no3 is steady without needing to dose anymore potassium nitrate. I'm needing to clean the glass daily and getting a lot of brown algae as well, but colors are better than they ever have been.

I'll get back to cleaning things up and not looking so dingy, but it just goes to show that sometimes we might think there is excess nutrients when in reality there isn't enough or the balance of import/export is off.

Good luck, I'm sure things will start looking better soon!

I'm feeding way more if I compare a month ago. I wasn't feeding the corals, I was just adding potassium and iodine here and there. I can see the difference in the corals's colors (one more than others). At this point I don't see any NO3/PO4, but I'm sure I have some due to the brown hair algae growing in the tank.

I'll keep posting changes. Hopefully positive!

 

[Omie]

Dr.Dator,
That's a really amazing tank! I'll check in a few days to see if my NO3/P04 is being detectable. Progress of the corals will be posted soon, hoping my tank looks like yours!

I have a question???
I read that it's normal for my tank to have algae. After the tank get stable at the parameters including detectable NO3/P04 the algae will go away. It's that right? How you get your tank to be so clean? How you get the water to be so crystal clear?

I used to have it like that, but I had reactors that helped me. Pls, give me some tips!

 

[Johnic]

I'd like to know the answer as well. I have the same senario in my tank. I fear feeding too much as not to get algae turning my tank into a disaster. I also wonder if all my po4 and nitrates are being absorbed into the Rock and sand bed. I have a bit of green slime on the sand and rock now. I've been feeding more and don't see my po4 and nitrates show up on test but I need to clean my glass every other day if not more and the green slim is not getting better. Following along to know what to to do. I'm in the same boat.

 

[SoloGarth]

I try to keep my corals dark in color. The goal being dark but brightly colored. I control this by regulating the throughput of my bio pellet Rx. Too light pastel looking corals IMO are starving for nutrients and likely to die if anything stresses them further. On the other end brown corals result from too much nutrients.

There are a lot of entangled issues here though. Light effects coral colors as does flow and feeding schedule. I find it best to watch both algae growth and coral color and try to strike a good balance.

 

[Johnic]

I try to keep my corals dark in color. The goal being dark but brightly colored. I control this by regulating the throughput of my bio pellet Rx. Too light pastel looking corals IMO are starving for nutrients and likely to die if anything stresses them further. On the other end brown corals result from too much nutrients.

There are a lot of entangled issues here though. Light effects coral colors as does flow and feeding schedule. I find it best to watch both algae growth and coral color and try to strike a good balance.

Finding that balance no doubt is the key! Some master it without even knowing how they did it.

Dr. Dator:
What's your nutrient export methods. I've recently incorporated an ATS that's not growing algae just yet but my gfo has been running.

 

[dr.dator]

Even though my tank looks super clean in the picture there are definitely spots of algae here and there. Nothing problematic but I think it's nearly impossible to run a 100% algae free tank. The trick is to have good grazers and a proper clean up crew to keep it in check. Also, a stable tank seems less prone outbreaks of specific species. And I guess you can also cover your rocks with coral and there will be no space left for algae to grow on

I used to run carbon dosing with vodka and vinegar to control nutrients. If po4 got too high for my liking I'd run some GFO to lower it. However, two weeks ago I started the Zeolight regimen by Fauna Marin so I had to stop dosing vodka/vinegar as it is not compatible with the system. So far so good, but it's still too early to give a proper review...

 

[Omie]

It's been about a month with my new changes. More changes were made and others stayed the same. The tank has been stable, the only problem is the algae. I spent around $60 on a CUC and they are doing a great job. The only bad thing about the CUC is that the snails are knocking down my SPS. So far, it's been 2 of them. I think I can deal with that instead of the algae.

About the changes I have made, there are a few little ones. I increased the light intensity to 65% with the same amount of hours. My goal is still at 75% or more. I'm waiting for the corals reaction. Also, I finally synced my 2 mp10w with my reef link. I love this company, their products, and how easy it is to work with. I have programmed the mp10's to do twice a day nutrient transport. Let see if that will add some help to the feeding for my SPS.

I still have my reactors turned off and the feeding is basically the same.

This is the comparison of my Garf Bonsai

1/5/16
<a href="http://s1014.photobucket.com/user/omie11/media/reef%20central/27E9BC3B-82D4-45DD-9C8F-C04377F0F816.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af269/omie11/reef%20central/27E9BC3B-82D4-45DD-9C8F-C04377F0F816.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 27E9BC3B-82D4-45DD-9C8F-C04377F0F816.jpg"/></a>

1/14/16
<a href="http://s1014.photobucket.com/user/omie11/media/reef%20central/IMG_2796.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af269/omie11/reef%20central/IMG_2796.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_2796.jpg"/></a>

1/24/16
<a href="http://s1014.photobucket.com/user/omie11/media/reef%20central/IMG_2802.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af269/omie11/reef%20central/IMG_2802.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo IMG_2802.jpg"/></a>

The purple is coming back and the PE are more prominent.

This is my water parameters:
• 1/24/16
Salt: 1.024
Temp: 76.5
Alk: 8.0dKh
Ca: 400ppm
Mag: 1650ppm
Nitrate: 0ppm
PO4: 0ppm
Ph: 7.73

 

[markalot]

Looking better, there must be enough for them to feed on. I don't think you have to get elevated readings as long as you feed enough.

 

[sahin]

Looking better. In another couple of weeks can you post a round of photos of some of the oher acros as well? Thanks.

 

[gus6464]

A little bit of algae on the rocks is not the end of the world. Some people obsess with having super clean rock and don't know why.

Also if you want to dial down on the fish feeding but want to keep SPS nutrients up you can always dose amino acids. Aquavitro Fuel is cheap and does a great job.

 

[mitra49]

Following along..very interesting thread! any updated photos?

 

[Omie]

I'm back, but with lots of bad news!

The past month has been hell for my tank and myself! The colors were doing good and then they started turning brown. The PE decreased and the growth became slower. All my parameters were stable and consistent.

My yellow tang started to have something like seizures. I thought it died, but after 15mins he started to swim again. Few days later my cleaner shrimp disappeared. I had it for a long time and didn't have any problems at all. Then my favorite fish, the starry blenny, died. He was so healthy and happy! When I found him he was swollen and one of his eyes had popped out. Around the same week my fire shrimp disappeared too. I was so upset and frustrated bc I wasn't doing drastic changes to the tank and I normally don't put stress on my fish.

One day, trying to find out the problem of my crash, I found that the ph dropped to 7.4 from 7.9 (my normal ph). I opened the windows and did all I could for the tank to get back the O2 needed. It went up to 8!!! Weird!!! I closed the windows and in less than a hour the ph dropped drastically to 7.6.

The next day, I went to my LFS and bought the Zeovit balance, a ph buffer. I started dosing my tank and at the same time figuring out the problem. I blame not having enough O2 bc it is cold and the a/c was turned off and the house is lacking air movement. Every time I was off work I opened the windows to bring the ph up as much as I could. I was dosing the tank A LOT anyways to keep the ph in control. It was strange because years before I never had this situation, but I couldn't found the problem behind all this.

One day I was off from work, and I was having my breakfast. While I was eating I was looking at the tank and saw my clownfish not swimming normally. I grabbed a stick that I made and move him around and he started to swim normally again. Not even 1 min and he did the same thing. I move him again and everything went back to "normal" until the female started to do the same thing!!! Ooohhh sh&$!! My yellow tang started to swim really fast with seizures. My blue tang was doing the same thing and my clowns swimming slow.

Not knowing what to do I started to move my fish side to side and then I smell something burning. My first thought was the thermostat. I tried to turn it off from my surge protector and it wasn't responding. I unplugged it and this is what I found...

<a href="http://s1014.photobucket.com/user/omie11/media/reef%20central/F3EFD45B-B352-4CEB-AF92-35BD9B2003E2.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af269/omie11/reef%20central/F3EFD45B-B352-4CEB-AF92-35BD9B2003E2.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo F3EFD45B-B352-4CEB-AF92-35BD9B2003E2.jpg"/></a>

My thermostat exploded and it was electrocuting my fish. After I removed the broken glass and the residual of the thermostat from the tank the clowns started to swim better, but my 2 tangs were laying on the sand breathing heavily. I did a water change right away and spent over two hrs trying to make my tangs swim again.

I went to the store and bought an expensive thermostat that doesn't break and went back to the house and did another water change. 7hrs after the incident, the tangs were swimming. All corals were fine, but some of them started to turn white bc of stress with the w/c. The next day my yellow tang died. He looked almost the same way as my starry Blenny. It's frustrating, but it could be worse.

Right now I'm on vacation, hoping that the tank is stable. My mother-in-law is taking care of it and so far so good! My ph stays over 8 and the fish are happy.

***I need some answers!!!***
A broken/cracked thermostat that is transporting electricity in to the tank can decrease the ph of the water??? After I removed it, my ph has been over 8 and I'm not dosing anything at all, (as far as balance).

 

[Brisk]

wow what a story, you are lucky that YOU didn't get zapped either