Tangs - always prone to Ich or can it be erradicated?

[llebcire]

So here's my question-

I've always read/heard that Tangs are succeptible to Ich and can have an outbreak after stress, in poor conditions, etc.

Is there evidence, other than speculation, that the Tang will always be at risk for Ich even without it being introduced from an outside source?

As I recently posted, I just lost a purple tang but still have my qt running. The qt (20g high) was started with 20 gallons from my display and the HOT 250 hang on filter, with carbon and foam filter, that had been on the tank for several weeks. The qt was setup Tuesday and if I am going to use it I need to before the bacteria starves.

In my display, I have a Powder Blue Tang that I've had since last summer. He's fat, healthy, and has great colors. I changed my aquascaping in December and he popped Ich (or something similar) that is almost gone (feed zoe & garlic nori).

So...if Tangs are natural carriers of Ich, I'll take the qt down. If it can be permanently erradicated, I'll move him and the rest of the fish into the qt and treat with copper while the tank's allowed to fallow for 8-12 weeks.

The other fish are Chromis that appear to be almost ich proof.

Thanks!

-Eric

 

[wooden_reefer]

Tangs can be ich free, not difficult.


Some new tangs will not eat artifical plant food and only graze on algae. If this is so you will have to get it to feed well before rigorous QT.

All new fish that will not adjust to prepared food quickly may have to be acclimated before rigorous QT starts. This is an extra layer of difficulty. Diseases can strike when you are acclimating without treatment. For a difficult fish, I use UV against bacteria and diatom filter against ich and let it graze on live rock for a while first before rigorous QT. Such a fish can be in a QT for very long, sometimes months.

 

[llebcire]

The PBT was Ich free for 6+ months until the aquascaping - no new additions to cause an outbreak. Wondering if it was lying dormant waiting for stress?

As I mentioned, he's a great eater (pig). Eats prime reef socked in zoe twice a day along with a 2"x2" sheet of nori soaked in garlic and loves mysis so I think he's healthy enough to qt aside from the stress of a 24" tank.

I would like to qt/treat as I don't want ich issues in the future.

-Eric

 

[Peter Eichler]

The PBT was Ich free for 6+ months until the aquascaping - no new additions to cause an outbreak. Wondering if it was lying dormant waiting for stress?

As I mentioned, he's a great eater (pig). Eats prime reef socked in zoe twice a day along with a 2"x2" sheet of nori soaked in garlic and loves mysis so I think he's healthy enough to qt aside from the stress of a 24" tank.

I would like to qt/treat as I don't want ich issues in the future.

-Eric

The tang has most likely always had the ich, you're just now noticing it because it may have progressed and there may be more cysts. Stress does not cause ich, though it can allow it to get a better foothold. QT all fish and treat the parasite with copper or hyposalinity while leaving the tank fishless for at least 8 weeks.

 

[llebcire]

The tang has most likely always had the ich, you're just now noticing it because it may have progressed and there may be more cysts. Stress does not cause ich, though it can allow it to get a better foothold. QT all fish and treat the parasite with copper or hyposalinity while leaving the tank fishless for at least 8 weeks.

Thanks for the reply!

So...while my display is fishless...do I continue w/water changes? Do I feed or let the cleanup crew do their thing? I'm also thinking of days without light to get rid of some nuisance algae.

-Eric

 

[Peter Eichler]

Thanks for the reply!

So...while my display is fishless...do I continue w/water changes? Do I feed or let the cleanup crew do their thing? I'm also thinking of days without light to get rid of some nuisance algae.

-Eric

Water changes are up to you, but I'd just keep up with your typical maintennace. The same goes with feeding, it's your call... If you have nuisance algae a few days without light might help temporarily, but in the long run it nwon't do any good unless you tackle the nutrients that are feeding the algae.

 

[llebcire]

I'm getting ready to start the copper treatment in qt for all of the fish...should I do gradual hypo as well or isn't that necessary with copper?

-Eric

 

[Sk8r]

tangs are midwater swimmers, not accustomed to being near the sandy bottom. Ich lives in sand, between fish. Bottom-swimming fish tend to have a heavy slime coat that protects them,apparently: a mandy has so thick a coat the fish feels like a warm lump of Jello in the hand. A tang has a thin skin and less slime coat, as I understand, never having ventured to hold one. Rabbits are similar, another one not to hold in the hand. But with adequate quarantine and attention to water conditions, yes, you can be ich free. Putting the fish into treatment and then leaving your tank without fish (inverts ok) for 8 weeks should end the problem: starves out the parasite.

 

[Mattik]

I have had a yellow tang for about a year. When I first got it, a few spots appeared on its fins and sides. I immediately treated with kardon's "Ich Attack" (reef safe) at 1.5 times the normal dose.

The ich not only went away, but it never has come back. I would consider that "ich free".

I will say though, that every time I add a new fish, I use ich attack as a preventive measure. So maybe that is why it hasn't come back.

One more note: I wouldn't recommend this product for a heavy outbreak. It seems that it must be used very early at the onset of symptoms to be effective (I had one severe case in a newly acquired fish and this product did not cure the problem).

 

[RBU1]

I'm getting ready to start the copper treatment in qt for all of the fish...should I do gradual hypo as well or isn't that necessary with copper?

-Eric

NO not copper and hypo just use the copper. Keep the specific gravity in the normal 1.025 range.

What copper are you using?

 

[llebcire]

Earlier in the week I picked up Coppersafe. I'm using a 20H and I dosed 15 ml as of now to make sure the fish handle the copper. The suggested dose is 25ml, 5ml/4 gallons, l'll dose the rest in 24 hours.

I'll monitor the ammonia every 48 hours & change 4 or 8 gallons as needed. I started the qt with 20 gallons from my display & my HOT 250 that was on the display for a couple weeks. It does have carbon in it but apparently it won't remove the copper if it's more than 6 days old.

My livestock consists of 6 @ 1.75" chromis & my 5" PBT.

-Eric

 

[RBU1]

Earlier in the week I picked up Coppersafe. I'm using a 20H and I dosed 15 ml as of now to make sure the fish handle the copper. The suggested dose is 25ml, 5ml/4 gallons, l'll dose the rest in 24 hours.

I'll monitor the ammonia every 48 hours & change 4 or 8 gallons as needed. I started the qt with 20 gallons from my display & my HOT 250 that was on the display for a couple weeks. It does have carbon in it but apparently it won't remove the copper if it's more than 6 days old.

My livestock consists of 6 @ 1.75" chromis & my 5" PBT.

-Eric

OK good luck and keep adding it slow and wait at least a day or 2 between doses. Make sure you test regularly and if the fish stop eating stop adding copper. If they don't start eating again start to remove the copper ASAP. To be safe I would remove the carbon if you can.

 

[Triggerfish]

It does have carbon in it but apparently it won't remove the copper if it's more than 6 days old.
-Eric

..if the carbon is more than 6 days old it will not rmove the copper?

i would remove the carbon.
what are u using to test the copper level?

 

[Chris27]

Coppersafe is chelated copper, make sure that you have a test works in conjunction with it. Test's that are designed for ionic copper will not read chelated properly.

 

[llebcire]

Still looking for my copper test kit...will prolly need to buy one in the next few days.

-Eric

 

[Chris27]

I used the API kit for chelated - very difficult to read though. After a recommendation from another reefer, I switched to the Red Sea kit which comes with ionic copper, that kit is much better.

 

[t4zalews]

people will have different opinions on this...but I use to ALWAYS have ich on my fish.

once I bought a UV sterilizer my ich problems completely went away. Have not had ich since. I changed nothing, except the addition of the UV. I seriously NEVER have ich and I've had at least 5 different tangs in my tank (not at the same time).

 

[RBU1]

people will have different opinions on this...but I use to ALWAYS have ich on my fish.

once I bought a UV sterilizer my ich problems completely went away. Have not had ich since. I changed nothing, except the addition of the UV. I seriously NEVER have ich and I've had at least 5 different tangs in my tank (not at the same time).

Consider yourself lucky

 

[Chris27]

Science has the answer for everything - understanding the life cycle of the parasite and how it progresses is the fist step in eradication.

To date, the only sure fire way to break the life cycle is to attack it in the free swimming stage. Garlic and other herbal remedies will not kill the parasite and UV's may get some of the free swimming theronts, but they aren't near efficient enough to get them all.

Copper, Hyposalinity and Formalin are the most accepted methods to break the life cycle, since each method treats ALL the water, every free swimming theront is addressed.

 

[llebcire]

So the fish have been in qt for 2 weeks.

The PBT was clean of all visible traces within the first couple days of coppersafe, but in the last few days it's showing discolored bumps again, although not the salt-like granuals.

I'll try and get a pic later.

It isn't flashing, eats like a pig and looks healthy (albeit a little pale, presumably from stress in the smallish qt).

Been doing frequent water changes and feeding Prime Reef soaked in Zoe twice daily with garlic Nori every morning.

I would assume this is part of the 28 day cycle?

-Eric