tyree most wanted capricornis

FragGuy,

Do start your own thread on your spawning fish!:) You have quite an assortment of large fish for a reef tank. Very interested in their behavoir as some aren't considered too reef safe. Large Angels are my favorite fish btw!:cool:

Roland
 
I've not read through this whole thread, but IMO that coral is not rare. I have a colony in my tank, and will have frags in a few months. Many people have that growth/color form, it's no big deal. $200 for a frag.... what a joke.

Well, now I've read through most of the thread. $200 a frag is still a bit much!!! I don't have a very good digital camera, but I will try and get a photo of mine. I'd be willing to bet that the growth form is very dependent upon current, and you may be able to get the 'nodules' in the middle with certain currents/nutrient conditions/lighting.

- Greg Hiller
 
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Frags

Frags

Greg, forward photo to Steve tyree. If you have it? You have a one of a kind. But all photo's submitted to Steve are not the same coral. I hope you do have it, but doubt it seriously.
 
I agree that there are a number of green with purple rim form of caps out there. I have at the moment three and possible a fourth form that have similar color combination but of varying shades of green/purple rim. But only one out of the four which is the one that I sent Steve matches Lengââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s morph the best. The others have subtle differences that distinguish them from Lengââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s.

The intent of the thread was to find out if it would be possible to track a coral of the original lineage of the Leng Sy montipora and then try to re-establish it into the hobby. Since it was presumably lost back in 96-97 there is some doubt that this will be possible. It could still happen but it seems less likely as time passes. In that case the alternative is to find the closest match that has not been verified to be a descendant of the original mother colony but perhaps is the same morph that may have come via a different route into the hobby.

I think that $200 dollars was just a rumor, unless it was a wild colony not a frag. Can you trace the origin of your piece?

I should be ready to ship some frags out in the next 2 weeks once I get back from my vacation.
 
Hmmm....the origin of mine. I think I got it from some guy in California a few years back I was trading with. I might have his name somewhere. As I recall I think I also received the 'gift' of the Acropora red bugs from the same guy! This was back when almost no one knew about the red bugs, so I don't fault the guy. The Acropora that they came in on was only very mildly affected by the buggers.
 
Greg
I'd be willing to bet that the growth form is very dependent upon current, and you may be able to get the 'nodules' in the middle with certain currents/nutrient conditions/lighting.

OK! This is NOT a Leng Sy coral, for those that think it's a fluke!!
but Greg may have a point.
This is what the coral look like six month after I got it!
before.jpg


After beeing fraged and growing again 1 1/2 year later
PE.jpg


And today's, diferent bulbs and current
NewPE.jpg
 
BTW, I never ment to say that I had one of the coveted Leng Sy corals, but that many corals have a similar, or nearly identical color/morphology, and I can't see the big deal.
 
Coral

Coral

Greg, I guess some of us are just into more than others. I personally love collecting different exotic corals. Especially ones that others don't have. I haven't seen one that matches the photo's that Steve Tyree has on his site of Leng Sy's cap. I guess different strokes for different folks makes the world go round.
 
Greg,

I have to agree! It seems rather silly to me. I was over at another local reefer's house yesterday and he has a cap that is very similar, if not identical to the "Leng Sy" cap. It just seems like this is going the way of clothing . . . got to get the "Calvin Klein Montipora digitat" . . . It is nice to have unique corals, but to worry about getting a coral from a particular lineage is silly if there are identical corals out there. Why pay the premium for a name? Oh and there are a heck of a lot more corals out there than get posted on this forum (or any for that matter). Some guy could be mass producing the "Leng Sy" cap in rural Maine and we wouldn't know about it because quite frankly he doesn't care.

Just my opinion,

Steve

Greg Hiller said:
BTW, I never ment to say that I had one of the coveted Leng Sy corals, but that many corals have a similar, or nearly identical color/morphology, and I can't see the big deal.
 
steve and greg,

Well it appears that the original Leng Sy was lost. I have seen no substantial evidence that anyone kept it going for more then a year. So in this case the linneage issue is a moot point. Now if someone is falsely claiming to have the correct linneage when they dont, that is another issue and one that should be dealt with, since there are collectors out there who have been paying $200 or more for the 'real Leng Sy'. I have sold no such corals no have ever claimed to have had the 'real Leng Sy', since 1996. It may turn out that the linneage can be established, but it has not been established as of yet IMHO. If you are not into the linneage issue, no big deal. There are however reef collectors who are.

What we are debating now is who may have the best copy. A purple edge on a dark green Monti with bright green polyps is a monti that is similar to Lengs in color. The width of the purple edge and the height of the nodules has not been duplicated by any other monti that I have seen images of. Rafael's monti is the closest I have seen to date. If anyone else has something similar please post images or links to images.
 
sschafer said:
Greg,

I have to agree! It seems rather silly to me. I was over at another local reefer's house yesterday and he has a cap that is very similar, if not identical to the "Leng Sy" cap. It just seems like this is going the way of clothing . . . got to get the "Calvin Klein Montipora digitat" . . . It is nice to have unique corals, but to worry about getting a coral from a particular lineage is silly if there are identical corals out there. Why pay the premium for a name? Oh and there are a heck of a lot more corals out there than get posted on this forum (or any for that matter). Some guy could be mass producing the "Leng Sy" cap in rural Maine and we wouldn't know about it because quite frankly he doesn't care.

Just my opinion,

Steve
I have to agree. Who cares where it came from? All I care about is how a particular coral looks in my tank. The Leng Sy cap may look totally different in my tank than others. I may have less nodule growth or different color variations. When it boils down to it, we want what looks best in our systems, we should want Nike and Calvin Klein corals. All this is going to raise the prices we pay as consumers and flood the market with fakes. Not a good idea IMO.

-TONY
 
Corals

Corals

Tony then why are you trying to stock tank up now with different and hard to get pieces? I disagree with you and Greg. There are collectors out there in every phase of industry.
Yours maybe corals and others maybe guns. Just because you and Greg will not pay a premium for lets say a coral, but you would pay to jack up your truck. Now for me that is a waste of money! Now that is my personel opinion. But you feel a need for a lifted vehicle and others feel needs for rare corals. Why not just leave it at learning something that we all didn't know about until Steve posted the linneage of this coral. I don't have the coral but I'm sure I'll end up buying a frag of it. And besides frags are selling for $50.00 and I've seen you pay that for easy to get colonies at local lfs? Why not keep this going with informative information on this coral and photos of similiar corals and keep negative comments at bay.
 
tonytooth said:
All this is going to raise the prices we pay as consumers and flood the market with fakes. Not a good idea IMO.
Unfortunately, this has already been going on. Some in this thread will know exactly to what I refer.
 
Chuck,

Come on, where you not just in my store complaining that ORA is making A.tortuosa frags available to LFS. I sell them for $30 compared to your $80-$100. I believe your were concerned with what these ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œcheapââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ frags were going to do to the market. I think you also made the statement that you had the true A.tortuosa and ORA did not. Personally, I donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t care what you sell your frags or what you call them but I felt compelled to point out the hypocrisy of your statement. If I am not mistaken, you post quite often, about how completion is good for the industry. I hope you can understand my confusion. To me it seems your against ââ"šÂ¬Ã…"œhighââ"šÂ¬Ã‚ prices if youââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢re the one buying.

Tony,

How about this, when I need a crown for #19 and you sell it to me for $60. Youââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢re making excessive amounts of money selling them for $100-$125. Now I am guessing at the prices but I hope you get the point. Who I am I to tell you what you can sell your goods for. I have no idea of what you expenses are, what type materials you use or how much time it takes you to make that piece. Come on tell me, I bet it takes only 5 minutes and $5 worth of supplies to make a crown.




To sum up, everyone is entitled to profit from their efforts. If you donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t like the price than donââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t buy it. If enough people feel the same way then demand with drop and so will the price. Quit you *****ing and enjoy the hobby for what it is. This no one is allowed to profit but me mentally has to stop or it will be the end of us all.
 
ichthyman said:
Tony,
Come on tell me, I bet it takes only 5 minutes and $5 worth of supplies to make a crown.
No that would be how long and how much money in supplies it would take to make an overflow box.

A crown on the other hand actually takes quite a bit of money in material. Precious metals ring a bell? I spend $400.00 an ounce for metals. Not to mention $30.00 an ounce for porcelains or $75 for one diamond disk that's no bigger than 1" accross and 1/10 of millimeter thick. BTW if you need a frag cut with my diamond disk, I'll cut you one for free because your my friend and you've helped me out over the years. ;)

BTW the tort I got from you is not the Oregon blue that chuck is speaking of. It is no doubt still a nice piece but it's not the blue tort. This is more purple. I am happy with it none the less.
 
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Personally, I like the interest in rare SPS because generally what happens is a certain species or color morph is aggressively fragged / split and spread out across the hobby. This whole thread is about a single coral that was not aggressively spread and 'died out'. Think about the original Seattle blue tortuosa. Don't forget it was ONE COLONY of potentially limited size. It might even have been a single branch. That same coral is now in dozens (if not hundreds) of tanks. Though slow-growing, it is very hardy and holds color well in varied lighting schemes (without requiring 400 watt MH). I don't doubt that within out lifetimes LFS will be selling tanks of cultured frags of corals that used to be rare, and the blue tort will probably be one of the first, though it COULD have gone the way of the Leng Sy cap.

I was just up at Steve Tyree's place two days ago and saw the Raphael cap. It looks intriguing, that's all I'll say. I am certainly in line for a frag. I also wanted to say that I buy 'unusual' frags from Steve all the time, and I am probably one of his safe customers in that I have never lost one of his frags - they are all still alive in my system. At the same time, if any of my colonies get large enough to frag, I do so gladly and pass them on to another reefer whose system I can trust. It's not about money for me - it's about beautiful creatures and keeping a 'bloodline' alive in captivity. When people start worrying about environmental impact of the reef aquarium hobby, it is always nice to point to a single coral that now exists in 100's of tanks.

Steve, as a novel idea, did you ever think about a national 'frag' registry for the Raphael cap? It might be interesting to keep a couple generations on file - to see who buys it, how many of those people keep it alive, and if any of their colonies get to fraggable size, who they pass their frags on to. I'll tell you one thing - if this sky blue monti cap you sold me holds color, I will set one up myself. This thing is AWESOME!
 
John - I am gonna leave that one alone, but I will say you are way off base in your interpretation of the meaning of my earlier comment. :rolleyes:
 
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