automatic water change
- Thread starter DRThompson
- Start date
mrx66699
New member
Jeremy my man its Matt .....didn't they tell you when you got there that you have got to stay away from those cookies in Denver ....Im surprised your still with us after Saturday night WOW .......what happens at MACNA stays at MACNA ...good to see you and a great booth presentation with lots of great products.....thanks for helping me out with the roller (AWESOME CUSTOMER SERVICE FOR SURE)
SpectraPure
.Registered Member
Matt,
Thanks for being a loyal customer. MACNA was so much fun. It was a lot of work my man, but a very cool experience. I am glad that I was able to help you out with the roller. Let me know if you need any advice on optimizing your RODI system for performance and longevity.
Jeremy
AquamanE
Active member
LITERMETER III REVIEW BY EDDIE SOLER (AquamanE)
As many of you know this thread has proven many ways to make reefing easier for many. At the time of this response this thread has over 36,000 views. Dr. David Thompson started this when he choose to research different ways to perform Automatic water Changes (AWC).
As the thread progressed many had their own ideas with eBay pumps, medical grade pumps, and others very capable of performing the task. Dr. Thompson bought and currently uses a Stenner 100DM4 pump, and so do I. Mid-way through I was approached by Spectrapure to give the LM3 a try and post a “review”. So here it is.
I will use Dr. Thompson’s research on the Liter Meter 3 (LM3) as this will make it easier to review those important topics on the pump. My responses will be in a different color for easier reading.
He checked out the liter meter, masterflex pumps and Stenner pumps for this project. I can’t comment on any other pump since I have only used the Stenner and the LM3. Below where his thoughts on the LM3 after his exhaustive search, and my response.
LiterMeter PRO's:
Easiest to setup- No doubt easy to set up. Trying to be careful though I reached out to Customer Service at Spectrapure and they guided me through the whole process in 10 minutes.
Designed for auto water changes- The LM3 can be used for more than just AWC’s, it can be used for other precise dosing such as 2 part, trace elements, etc.. It also has a very nice module for feeding Kalkwasser.
Best peristaltic pump in the industry (aquarium)- I don’t know if it’s the “best” peristaltic pump, not being an engineer, but it is definitely an “aquarium” pump. Many of the others mentioned are industrial chemical pumps (Stenner), ink press pumps (eBay), medical grade pumps (Masterflex). So this is definitely a pump geared toward aquarium use.
Excellent customer service - read comments, blogs, recommendations from friends, Reef Central forum messages- Dr. Thompson used the mentioned process’s for this comment. I experienced it first-hand. My multiple calls to Spectrapure where always answered immediately and by knowledgeable folks in the CS department.
Quietest of the 3 choices- Again can’t opine on anything other than the LM3 vs. Stenner. Some on here have called the Stenner a “jet engine”. I wouldn’t call it that loud but it is DEFINITELY loud. The LM3 is VERY quiet. The fact that my AWC pump sits in a closet, I can hear the Stenner (although acceptable to me), the LM3 I would not know it was working if I didn’t sit there in front of it and listen, or check the fresh SW bin to make sure it was being emptied every day.
LiterMeter Cons:
-more expensive new, though readily avail used at lower prices- Spectrapure has recently drop their price of the LM3. For how long? don’t know.
-Not apex compatible- This is a matter of semantics. While you control the amount changed by the Stenner with a Controller by letting it know how many minutes to stay on, you don’t need to do this with the LM3. You program how many liters (gals) you want to change per day and the LM3 does it. It calculates its own rates and divides that by 150 and does it all day long FOR you. Some may consider this a CON since you have no control over this, but if all you want is x # of gallons changes per day, it happens. Regarding safety features, all we do with a Stenner is program the controller to shut off if the fresh SW bin is empty, or the sump is getting overfilled. It’s just an ON/OFF feature in controllers. Why can’t that be done with the LM3 with the same float switches used for any other pump. Ex. If fresh SW bin empty “plug#5”=off. No different.
-Require periodic calibration for accuracy- I found this to actually be a PRO. The LM3 requires a calibration so that it can take into account line lengths, head pressure etc. to determine whether one pump needs to be faster or slower than the other to deliver the same volume. It then adjusts its flow rate and time to deliver both sides equally. You can’t do that with the Stenner, it’s a fixed rate by both heads equally, regardless of line pressure, length or head. CS at Spectrapure tells me you only need to do if you change lines, tubing on pump, or maybe once a year. It took me 10 minutes.
-Not designed for continuous use- Don’t know that I agree with this either. The LM3 divides your requests by 150 and performs this all day 150 times. I ran it for 1.5 months with Zero issues.
CONCLUSION: The LM3 is a great pump. For the purposes of AWC I don’t see many drawbacks other than (now) just a slight increase in price, and the fact that you are stuck with 150x per day whether you want that or not. But again, is this really a draw back? I will warn though that although this pump is capable of many other things including precision dosing and ATO capabilities, if you are using for AWC that is all you can do with it. In the future you decide to stop AWC, then you continue to have a multifaceted pump, unlike the Stenner. All you can do with it is AWC. All this being said the LM3 is backed up by a 5 year warranty, much more than the others. Couple that with excellent customer service, you have a winner. I recommend it for anyone looking for a reliable, accurate AWC pump. Try getting that and/or technical service from an industrial chemical pump company about your aquarium needs, or an eBay guy that pulled it off an ink press.
As many of you know this thread has proven many ways to make reefing easier for many. At the time of this response this thread has over 36,000 views. Dr. David Thompson started this when he choose to research different ways to perform Automatic water Changes (AWC).
As the thread progressed many had their own ideas with eBay pumps, medical grade pumps, and others very capable of performing the task. Dr. Thompson bought and currently uses a Stenner 100DM4 pump, and so do I. Mid-way through I was approached by Spectrapure to give the LM3 a try and post a “review”. So here it is.
I will use Dr. Thompson’s research on the Liter Meter 3 (LM3) as this will make it easier to review those important topics on the pump. My responses will be in a different color for easier reading.
He checked out the liter meter, masterflex pumps and Stenner pumps for this project. I can’t comment on any other pump since I have only used the Stenner and the LM3. Below where his thoughts on the LM3 after his exhaustive search, and my response.
LiterMeter PRO's:
Easiest to setup- No doubt easy to set up. Trying to be careful though I reached out to Customer Service at Spectrapure and they guided me through the whole process in 10 minutes.
Designed for auto water changes- The LM3 can be used for more than just AWC’s, it can be used for other precise dosing such as 2 part, trace elements, etc.. It also has a very nice module for feeding Kalkwasser.
Best peristaltic pump in the industry (aquarium)- I don’t know if it’s the “best” peristaltic pump, not being an engineer, but it is definitely an “aquarium” pump. Many of the others mentioned are industrial chemical pumps (Stenner), ink press pumps (eBay), medical grade pumps (Masterflex). So this is definitely a pump geared toward aquarium use.
Excellent customer service - read comments, blogs, recommendations from friends, Reef Central forum messages- Dr. Thompson used the mentioned process’s for this comment. I experienced it first-hand. My multiple calls to Spectrapure where always answered immediately and by knowledgeable folks in the CS department.
Quietest of the 3 choices- Again can’t opine on anything other than the LM3 vs. Stenner. Some on here have called the Stenner a “jet engine”. I wouldn’t call it that loud but it is DEFINITELY loud. The LM3 is VERY quiet. The fact that my AWC pump sits in a closet, I can hear the Stenner (although acceptable to me), the LM3 I would not know it was working if I didn’t sit there in front of it and listen, or check the fresh SW bin to make sure it was being emptied every day.
LiterMeter Cons:
-more expensive new, though readily avail used at lower prices- Spectrapure has recently drop their price of the LM3. For how long? don’t know.
-Not apex compatible- This is a matter of semantics. While you control the amount changed by the Stenner with a Controller by letting it know how many minutes to stay on, you don’t need to do this with the LM3. You program how many liters (gals) you want to change per day and the LM3 does it. It calculates its own rates and divides that by 150 and does it all day long FOR you. Some may consider this a CON since you have no control over this, but if all you want is x # of gallons changes per day, it happens. Regarding safety features, all we do with a Stenner is program the controller to shut off if the fresh SW bin is empty, or the sump is getting overfilled. It’s just an ON/OFF feature in controllers. Why can’t that be done with the LM3 with the same float switches used for any other pump. Ex. If fresh SW bin empty “plug#5”=off. No different.
-Require periodic calibration for accuracy- I found this to actually be a PRO. The LM3 requires a calibration so that it can take into account line lengths, head pressure etc. to determine whether one pump needs to be faster or slower than the other to deliver the same volume. It then adjusts its flow rate and time to deliver both sides equally. You can’t do that with the Stenner, it’s a fixed rate by both heads equally, regardless of line pressure, length or head. CS at Spectrapure tells me you only need to do if you change lines, tubing on pump, or maybe once a year. It took me 10 minutes.
-Not designed for continuous use- Don’t know that I agree with this either. The LM3 divides your requests by 150 and performs this all day 150 times. I ran it for 1.5 months with Zero issues.
CONCLUSION: The LM3 is a great pump. For the purposes of AWC I don’t see many drawbacks other than (now) just a slight increase in price, and the fact that you are stuck with 150x per day whether you want that or not. But again, is this really a draw back? I will warn though that although this pump is capable of many other things including precision dosing and ATO capabilities, if you are using for AWC that is all you can do with it. In the future you decide to stop AWC, then you continue to have a multifaceted pump, unlike the Stenner. All you can do with it is AWC. All this being said the LM3 is backed up by a 5 year warranty, much more than the others. Couple that with excellent customer service, you have a winner. I recommend it for anyone looking for a reliable, accurate AWC pump. Try getting that and/or technical service from an industrial chemical pump company about your aquarium needs, or an eBay guy that pulled it off an ink press.
Last edited:
mrx66699
New member
Very nice Eddie and a nice professional write up.....I have had mine running now for over 4 years and just love it.....thank you for the time and research Eddie and much thanks to Spectrapure...and Jeremy....for supporting our club and this wonderful donation.....as Eddie has already stated you can't say enough about the level of dedication and support these guys offer A+ rating for sure ....
DRThompson
2018 FMAS President
Thanks for the great write up Eddie. Special thanks to Spectrapure for donating the LM3 to our club.
AquamanE
Active member
Yes Howard- we saw it at MACNA Denver- Looks very interesting for sure. Only issue i see with it is that you have to have an APEX to run it. Release should be within a few months, was not aware of the price. BTW- doubt the "to the drop" statement. Its a peristaltic pump. Difficult to have that kind of accuracy.
They also have a propellar pump coming out next year called WAVE. Again a APEX product, also looks very promising.
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automatic water change
We still don't know a lot about it, but apparently they've put in a lot of effort towards the reliability and accuracy. They are calling this a "fluid metering system", so we'll just have to wait on real reviews.
Here's a good overview if it will allow the link (which i guess it won't...) oh well do you're own google search
http://************.com/2014/09/16/neptune-systems-dos-dosing-pump/
We still don't know a lot about it, but apparently they've put in a lot of effort towards the reliability and accuracy. They are calling this a "fluid metering system", so we'll just have to wait on real reviews.
Here's a good overview if it will allow the link (which i guess it won't...) oh well do you're own google search
http://************.com/2014/09/16/neptune-systems-dos-dosing-pump/
We still don't know a lot about it, but apparently they've put in a lot of effort towards the reliability and accuracy. They are calling this a "fluid metering system", so we'll just have to wait on real reviews.
Here's a good overview if it will allow the link (which i guess it won't...) oh well do you're own google search
http://************.com/2014/09/16/neptune-systems-dos-dosing-pump/
We'll see, the pump heads look pretty cheap, I've got a stack of those from a surplus auction. they do perform well but are all plastic including the shaft from the motor so, long, long, term reliability is still up in the air, If they are the same type the life span is only a few thousand hours. (and they are easily broken if you happen to drop something while changing tubing) but they use better than average quality tubing and tolerances are very good for accruacy. If the Pump heads are made by the same company should be a good addition to the hobby...... but as far as 350 for an apex controlled system you should be able to do that with any old pump and the coding of you apex for pennies on the dollar............
SpectraPure
.Registered Member
Eddie,
Thank you very much for the opportunity to provide a great quality product for your reef club. Please let me know who wins it in the raffle. Also, I would like to thank all of FMAS for the opportunity to be a part of this thread. If anyone ever has any kind of technical needs, and just needs a little bit of advice please drop me a line.
As for the new Neptune product. I am sure it will be a decent pump, but Eddie is right it is only for Apex users. This is a high-end only solution, and it will be interesting to see the reliability and accuracy of this product.
I am curious as to how much the plastic pumps are that you all seem to go through a lot? I do however have just a DIY pump. It is not the cheapest, but for 90 dollars you don't have to worry about replacing the plastic ones all the time.
Jeremy
Thank you very much for the opportunity to provide a great quality product for your reef club. Please let me know who wins it in the raffle. Also, I would like to thank all of FMAS for the opportunity to be a part of this thread. If anyone ever has any kind of technical needs, and just needs a little bit of advice please drop me a line.
As for the new Neptune product. I am sure it will be a decent pump, but Eddie is right it is only for Apex users. This is a high-end only solution, and it will be interesting to see the reliability and accuracy of this product.
I am curious as to how much the plastic pumps are that you all seem to go through a lot? I do however have just a DIY pump. It is not the cheapest, but for 90 dollars you don't have to worry about replacing the plastic ones all the time.
Jeremy
DRThompson
2018 FMAS President
They are BIG also; the double head is nearly 12" long. I've been using mine for nearly a year now and have had NO problems!
acesq
Premium Member
+1. Mine is still going good strong. It is loud, but the calibration is not an issue for me. I have had no salinity creep while doing daily 5 gal water changes in a 400 system.
SchnitzelReef
Active member
DRThompson
2018 FMAS President
100DMP4
http://www.lockewell.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_6_30_33&products_id=160&zenid=d2e4e8b168322068f60d0733198ad233
go to lockewell.com; it's $284 with free shipping
http://www.lockewell.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_6_30_33&products_id=160&zenid=d2e4e8b168322068f60d0733198ad233
go to lockewell.com; it's $284 with free shipping
