EcoTech Radion vs Aquaillumination Sol

[mthomp]

the Radion has better spread, but the cost means its too close to the water, bottom line. imo unless Ecotech says splashes won't harm your 800dollars.

In fact they did rubberize the edges to minimalise any potential damage.

the thing i didnt like was when asked about the fan they said "its easy to replace" and they really did their best to avoid explaining the placement of it in general. I am a huge eco tech fan and when these were first shown I was blown away and ready to write a check. Now i think before i do i will be waiting for you beta testers to give a better review.

 

[pmrossetti]

What? my AI's were 6" over my water before I moved them up for better spread less than a month ago. They are still alive and kicking. We have no idea how far up or down we need to hang the Radion to get acceptable par. That will take someone actually reviewing their units.

oh contrare, Ecotech says anything over 8" you lose the 250=par.

glad the AI could take the closeness. can the Radion?

 

[MedRed]

point accepted. can't AI add colors?

The AI's have 3 channels. That means you can have 3 colors max. That doesn't mean a better combination of 3 colors won't crop up at some point to replace the current Blue, Royal Blue, White standard.

The Radions have 6 channels and come with 5 different colors. That means that they could potentially add a puck with 6 different colors and also could mix 6 yet unused mixes of colors. That's a little more future proof IMO than the AI's.

I don't think the AI's are bad. They are GREAT for the new price. I think the Radions will be better if they are in your budget, but that remains to be proven.

 

[pmrossetti]

Get off this splash thing man. The Diode optics will not burst if splashed and all other electronics are sealed. Did you not see the photo of the internals in one of the many other radion threads you are posting in?

sorry if you don't share my concern. and yes i saw it. i'm not knowledgeable about watertight constructon from a photo.
what's wrong with posting n another thread?
i apologize if i'm wrong.

 

[pmrossetti]

The AI's have 3 channels. That means you can have 3 colors max. That doesn't mean a better combination of 3 colors won't crop up at some point to replace the current Blue, Royal Blue, White standard.

The Radions have 6 channels and come with 5 different colors. That means that they could potentially add a puck with 6 different colors and also could mix 6 yet unused mixes of colors. That's a little more future proof IMO than the AI's.

I don't think the AI's are bad. They are GREAT for the new price. I think the Radions will be better if they are in your budget, but that remains to be proven.

good points. time will tell i guess.

 

[MedRed]

oh contrare, Ecotech says anything over 8" you lose the 250=par.

glad the AI could take the closeness. can the Radion?

remember what I posted about the light spread? If you have to raise an AI 12" above the tank to get light to reach the edges all while creating major shadows and still not adequately lighting the tank, but you get ridiculous par right in the middle of the tank, is that worth it?

When I hung my lights @ 12" I was happy that I could switch back to the stock optics and possibly sell my 70º optics. Even with 2 fixtures on a 24x24 tank, the AI's just weren't cutting it with the stock optics. I had to go through the hassle of switching back to the 70º optics and was very happy with it.

Get off this splash thing man. The Diode optics will not burst if splashed and all other electronics are sealed. Did you not see the photo of the internals in one of the many other radion threads you are posting in?

This.

 

[pmrossetti]

remember what I posted about the light spread? If you have to raise an AI 12" above the tank to get light to reach the edges all while creating major shadows and still not adequately lighting the tank, but you get ridiculous par right in the middle of the tank, is that worth it?

When I hung my lights @ 12" I was happy that I could switch back to the stock optics and possibly sell my 70º optics. Even with 2 fixtures on a 24x24 tank, the AI's just weren't cutting it with the stock optics. I had to go through the hassle of switching back to the 70º optics and was very happy with it.



This.

if true, then fine no problem. but to raise the question was quite legitimate as others had raised it as well. any light 8" awl is a legit concern.
a little too defensive.

 

[rtparty]

I looked at the radions at macna between my shifts there and i was impressed at first but after watching their coraless demos of the system I became less impressed. the red and greens seem like a waste of leds to me. I do not feel my coral will benefit from those colors in growth or color in fact it almost seems like it may wash out some of the color. with the AI being half the cost, having wireless access and with them changing how the light is focused, no more hot spots in the middle of the tank, I feel AI comes out on top once again.

Here is a good test, go get a 50/50 mix of ATI Blue Plus and ATI Aquablue bulbs. Put that over the tank and see what happens to colors. Now switch just ONE of the Aquablues for a Purple Plus. See the amazing difference in colors in your tank.

And all of that is with bulbs that have MUCH better spectrum than an AI units. I promise you that in the near future, you will see people ditching the blue:white combo for more warmth and more full spectrum.

It has happened with every lighting technology we have used over our tanks. LEDs aren't going to be any different.

 

[pmrossetti]

Here is a good test, go get a 50/50 mix of ATI Blue Plus and ATI Aquablue bulbs. Put that over the tank and see what happens to colors. Now switch just ONE of the Aquablues for a Purple Plus. See the amazing difference in colors in your tank.

And all of that is with bulbs that have MUCH better spectrum than an AI units. I promise you that in the near future, you will see people ditching the blue:white combo for more warmth and more full spectrum.

It has happened with every lighting technology we have used over our tanks. LEDs aren't going to be any different.

i'm sure your 100percent correct. i even read that one mfr is working with an led mfr on developing leds specifically for aquariums. neat,huh?

rt, did you see my post on the new Panorama? 240par at 24".

 

[MedRed]

FYI, buyorpheklights.com is now dark

 

[pmrossetti]

FYI, buyorpheklights.com is now dark

RC has clout.

 

[wesleyforbes2]

Following.

 

[JohnM99]

Quote:
Originally Posted by pmrossetti
yes,i'm not sure about this full spectrum thing yet.doesn't the ocean filter out the reds anyway?

but i love the moon cycles on the AI.

and they come in black now
The deep ocean does, but corals also live in very shallow water such as shown in "How rare is this" thread. Also, we don't look at our corals in the ocean. We try to create lighting that aesthetically appeals to us as well as benefit the corals.

Interesting points - water actually filters our colors faster than most people realize - although some reefs are in less than 10 feet of water (where they face other challenges such as avoiding UV damage) most reefs are deeper.

The filtering of red light is very noticeable at even 10 feet - and most is gone shortly after that - so it is true that the full spectrum lights give "unnatural" lighting spectra - but it is also true that we can benefit from that. Just try taking underwater photos without and with flash. If you go down 40-60 feet and try that, you will get very drab photos without flash, and beautiful colors with flash. So, MedRed's point about the use of a broader spectrum in home aquaria is very valid. This is just one more thing that makes a home aquarium very different from a real life reef, but nonetheless enjoyable.

Here is an interesting discussion of color underwater in case you are interested and haven't had the pleasure of diving.....
http://vasyfille.com/2009/09/28/dive_visiblespectrum/

 

[steely185]

Seems it got noticed, including this thread

Check reef builders website for the article on captive aquatics

 

[gcarroll]

FYI, buyorpheklights.com is now dark

And now the damage control and cover-up begins. Mike Maddox also changed his linked-in profile. I'm sure it won't be long until we hear a statement that he is no longer affiliated with the company, which will be easy to do since he was never supposedly affiliated with the company before. Oh the tangled web we weave!

 

[BonsaiNut]

If you read his other threads you notice that he only like Orphek LEDS...a little digging revealed that he was a director at Orphek http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache%3AG-I_TGu4BkgJ%3Awww.linkedin.com%2Fin%2Forphek+michael+maddox+oraphek&cd=6&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us


and he owns the domain buyoprheklights.com

http://www.whois.net/whois/buyorpheklights.com.com

Reefsafe works for 60 Minutes Good job! The last thing this industry needs is a rotten apple spoiling things for personal gain. I LIKE the fact that new fixtures are coming out, and that each new fixture causes manufacturers to re-assess their prior designs, and to try to improve them. I am glad to hear that Orphek appears to be distancing themselves from this individual. With friends like this, who needs enemies?

 

[pmrossetti]

i wish we could get back to AI vs Radion.

 

[pciscott]

I think all the LED companies need to stop advertising par equivalents of a metal halides, as they only measure peak par and if you look at a spread graph they do not come close.

For most here this is a given, but for the new guy this is false advertisement and wrong. Can any of these companies say they put out as much usable light as a 250 halide per fixture?

I was at Macna and while the Radion light was very nicely put together, I did not see it over corals? They had extra modules they could have loaned to a coral vendor as they loan out pumps to many vendors to showcase product. Why would a company not put them over coral so our eyes could see the new spectrum at work?

Sanjay did a very nice talk on LED and while he did emphasize the fact that led lights would grow coral he did question the quality of light and spread compared to a metal halides.

One more note that was in Sanjay's graphs was the Radion put out less peak par and spread than an AI Sol Blue, why is this when it runs more watts and has a much higher price.

For those of you jumping in on the first round of Radion fixtures some pictures of the color with your AI units before you pull them down and the new lights to compare would be a treat. Even better a picture with half on one side AI and the other half Radion would be a FTS I would like to see.

I think the added colors will help with the spectrum the same as a couple T5 tubes would but at a premium for sure.

I also think the answer is in building single point multi color LED chips and think the new Kessel lights need some work, but have the rite idea. They offer multi color chips that include UV.

AI versus Radion, I wish either of them could boast the same amount of light as a 250 halides as their peek output comparison is pretty SHADY!

 

[ari5736]

From what I understand AI is coming out with warm white pucks, my thinking is that a few of these mixed with the exisiting pucks should really even out the color towards the colors in the upper part of the rainbow. As it stands now, I think their units are too cool without enough spectrum.
As for spread and par, I have mine mounted about 14" awl with all 40 degree optics and I have full coverage and still have to be very careful of not bleaching sps in the bottom of my 24" tall tank. While there is a lot of shadowing, I thought this was just LED lighting in general, and not sure if lowering the unit and changing to some 70 optics would change anything.

 

[pmrossetti]

From what I understand AI is coming out with warm white pucks, my thinking is that a few of these mixed with the exisiting pucks should really even out the color towards the colors in the upper part of the rainbow. As it stands now, I think their units are too cool without enough spectrum.
As for spread and par, I have mine mounted about 14" awl with all 40 degree optics and I have full coverage and still have to be very careful of not bleaching sps in the bottom of my 24" tall tank. While there is a lot of shadowing, I thought this was just LED lighting in general, and not sure if lowering the unit and changing to some 70 optics would change anything.

full coverage and shadowing? clarify?
tank size? how many AIs?