I learned about Zoanthid toxin the hard way......
- Thread starter steveoutlaw
- Start date
lordofthereef
One reef to rule them all
Well this thread got unearthed and I am just curious how you are doing Steve? Any permanent damage?
Also a suggestion to those who do want to boil their zoas to death... drop them in a bucket outside and leave them there to cool?
Also a suggestion to those who do want to boil their zoas to death... drop them in a bucket outside and leave them there to cool?
Shotgunlew
New member
My little brother was messing around in my tank last night, this morning he is throwing up, any chance that he ****ed off the zoa's in my tank & touched his hand to his mouth?
Chris
Chris
hllywd
Premier World Traveler
You know, anything is possible. I doubt it's related though. It is irresponsible having your tank where a little kid an reach it though. Water weighs a bit over 62 lbs/ cubic ft. I don't know how big your tank is but it's definately a hazard if he pulls it over on himself, consider the weight, broken glass, etc... Definately a DOA possibility.
As for him throwing up being related to playing with the tank, I still doubt it's from palytoxin, however recently, a local, very experienced reefer in the CORA forum had a severe life threatening infection after fragging some zoas. The way I understand there were three different marine organisms isolated in his bloodstream, so there is some danger. Have a look at this, it's first hand, recent, directly verifiable info, not washed through the internet "grapevine". http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1838538
Tim
As for him throwing up being related to playing with the tank, I still doubt it's from palytoxin, however recently, a local, very experienced reefer in the CORA forum had a severe life threatening infection after fragging some zoas. The way I understand there were three different marine organisms isolated in his bloodstream, so there is some danger. Have a look at this, it's first hand, recent, directly verifiable info, not washed through the internet "grapevine". http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1838538
Tim
Shotgunlew
New member
My little brothers not that little (16) but he is doing better, On another note If I have a cut on my hand, Could I to get infected.
hllywd
Premier World Traveler
Hmmm... Obviously I posted the wrong link, theis is the correct one: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1821465
Ask Hollback what he thinks.
Tim
Ask Hollback what he thinks.
Tim
Shotgunlew
New member
Thanks for all the help guys! I think im going to get a decent set of gloves for when I move my aquascape and do stuff of that nature.
Chris
Chris
highhopes592003
New member
I dont mean to be rude or anything but it can happen and I do believe somehow the palytoxins can go air borne when damaged and have been told they can since. Im no expert by any means, was a newbie to corals. I had read about them but not enough evidently. Wed bought a 100 gal. full of the most beautiful corals youd ever see about 2 months ago. Brought them home and put them in stock tanks until the water was finishing going thru the rodi. My husband & I both started to feel like we was getting a cold at the same exact time but wrote it off as thats all it was. We felt better in the morning. The smell you talked about was permeating throught the whole house but we thought it was just how corals smelled. The LR had corals growing all over them and was impossible not to damage, especially the zoos it seemed. I remember them squishing in my glove and felt bad I did it to them.
The next day we put the corals back in thier tank and immediately we started feeling bad agian. My throat felt like it was closing off, sneezing like crazy, hard to breath like something heavy was on my chest, choking on a thick slime that I couldnt cough up hardly, like a bad flu that drags down so bad ya dont wanna move from bed. My husband wasnt as bad feeling as me and he mentioned it might be the corals but I wasnt convinced totally. He went on to work. I just slept n slept like I could barely wake up. I woke about 2 am and was like I was paralyzed, it took everything I could to pull the phone cord that was just above my head down to where I could call someone, then I couldnt get my fingers to dial the numbers. it took another 45 minutes to get my husband on the phone. He came home and wanted to take me to the ER but Id made myself get up and thought I was feeling better, so told him so and went back to sleep.
I believe it was the next morning I woke and my husband is getting ready to get in the tank. I started geekin, beggin him to stay out of it. We didnt get all the corals in a right place and he was going to move them around. I told hom the corals was making us sick and please dont mess with them. So he goes and gets a T- SHIRT wraps it around his face as a mask and thought itd be ok. By time for him to go to work he was so sick like I was. Needless to say he was off work the next couple days. I remember him saying if where not better by morning we are going to the ER. I couldnt respond but heard everything. It was like I was trapped in my own body at times. I kept moaning a long drawn out moan then followed by one that was like choppy and I couldnt stop it no matter how hard I tried. Like I had no control. Ron & mom where on the phone and she called poison control and they laughed saying there wasnt anything in that tank that could hurt us. So mom told him to cover the tank and open all the doors and windows. Id got enough strength to get up to go the the restroom and got on craigslist to find someone to come get them out of our house. Id woke up at one point and my dog was even shaking uncontrolably, walking like she was drunk. The other was puking. By 11 am I was up feeling better, dogs seem to be ok and I wasnt paralzed feeling, still jittery and it still seems I have a cough from it. Other than that it was over once that smell got aired out. A fella came and got them and I now have a beautiful fish only lol. It was a miserable experience and suggest no one be stubborn about going to the ER like I was cause I now see how much danger it really was but I couldnt even think I was so sick at the time. Sorry this is long but I wouldnt want another newbie to go thru this. I even had a person on here say when he read my post trying to warn others that he was looking for a punchline that he thought it was a joke. Seriously this is no joke, it did happen and we wore gloves when handling them. I cant prove it was air borne and not cross contamination but its funny that my dogs got sick that was in another room with a gate to keep them in there. I dont know, didnt mean to butt in, I just wanted the poster and any newbies to know it happened here too kinda thing. Love ya all and wouldnt want anyone to go thru it.
The next day we put the corals back in thier tank and immediately we started feeling bad agian. My throat felt like it was closing off, sneezing like crazy, hard to breath like something heavy was on my chest, choking on a thick slime that I couldnt cough up hardly, like a bad flu that drags down so bad ya dont wanna move from bed. My husband wasnt as bad feeling as me and he mentioned it might be the corals but I wasnt convinced totally. He went on to work. I just slept n slept like I could barely wake up. I woke about 2 am and was like I was paralyzed, it took everything I could to pull the phone cord that was just above my head down to where I could call someone, then I couldnt get my fingers to dial the numbers. it took another 45 minutes to get my husband on the phone. He came home and wanted to take me to the ER but Id made myself get up and thought I was feeling better, so told him so and went back to sleep.
I believe it was the next morning I woke and my husband is getting ready to get in the tank. I started geekin, beggin him to stay out of it. We didnt get all the corals in a right place and he was going to move them around. I told hom the corals was making us sick and please dont mess with them. So he goes and gets a T- SHIRT wraps it around his face as a mask and thought itd be ok. By time for him to go to work he was so sick like I was. Needless to say he was off work the next couple days. I remember him saying if where not better by morning we are going to the ER. I couldnt respond but heard everything. It was like I was trapped in my own body at times. I kept moaning a long drawn out moan then followed by one that was like choppy and I couldnt stop it no matter how hard I tried. Like I had no control. Ron & mom where on the phone and she called poison control and they laughed saying there wasnt anything in that tank that could hurt us. So mom told him to cover the tank and open all the doors and windows. Id got enough strength to get up to go the the restroom and got on craigslist to find someone to come get them out of our house. Id woke up at one point and my dog was even shaking uncontrolably, walking like she was drunk. The other was puking. By 11 am I was up feeling better, dogs seem to be ok and I wasnt paralzed feeling, still jittery and it still seems I have a cough from it. Other than that it was over once that smell got aired out. A fella came and got them and I now have a beautiful fish only lol. It was a miserable experience and suggest no one be stubborn about going to the ER like I was cause I now see how much danger it really was but I couldnt even think I was so sick at the time. Sorry this is long but I wouldnt want another newbie to go thru this. I even had a person on here say when he read my post trying to warn others that he was looking for a punchline that he thought it was a joke. Seriously this is no joke, it did happen and we wore gloves when handling them. I cant prove it was air borne and not cross contamination but its funny that my dogs got sick that was in another room with a gate to keep them in there. I dont know, didnt mean to butt in, I just wanted the poster and any newbies to know it happened here too kinda thing. Love ya all and wouldnt want anyone to go thru it.
Lynnmw1208
New member
yikes! so how do you avoid this? do we have to wear doctor's masks? that is crazy! if it's in the water it can still get out? I'm almost afraid to have zoos now
BeltwayBandit
Member
In Steve's case he was trying to kill nuisance zoas on some rock with boiling water (source: the article cited and confirmed with personal conversations with Steve during and after the incident). The toxin became airborne with the steam and he inhaled it. I have read other accounts of responses from dermal contact. My opinion is, if you have zoanthids use plastic gloves while handling them. In the studies cited not all of the zoas they sampled contained the toxin, but the ones that did had it in concentrations that can cause serious medical issues.
Lynnmw1208
New member
I was talking about what highhopes said. didn't seem like they were boiling anything off rocks and yet they still has symptoms.
ntevidence
New member
Palytoxin Found in Palythoa sp. Zoanthids (Anthozoa, Hexacorallia) Sold in the Home Aquarium Trade:
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0018235
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0018235
sbreefer
Afflicted Reefer
Wow. I read about you in discover magazine!!!! To the guy above. Palytoxin DOES cause this and everyone should read the article:
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/n...adliest-poison-in-an-aquarium-store-near-you/
Do you have a better photo of the toxic zoos?
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/n...adliest-poison-in-an-aquarium-store-near-you/
Do you have a better photo of the toxic zoos?
:wavehand: How's it going down there in NC? I'm sure you miss the beltway traffic terribly. :lol:
reefaquarium
In Memoriam
Wow man, I'm really sorry to hear this. I have to be a lot more carful when handleing them. Thanks for sharing though
steveoutlaw
New member
It's been over 4 years since it happened and I still remember it like it's yesterday. I wound up on steroids and an inhaler for almost 8 months. Luckily it seems that I didn't suffer any long term damage as a result, but those 8 months were not fun.
