Juvenile red sea regal angel or not?!

[msaba]

Hi guys,

just purchased a juvenile red sea regal angel from a very reputable source. The angel is 3.75 inches and looks healthy. MY question is, his chest/ventral area is grey, not orange as I expected. My retailer tells me it won't turn orange until it becomes an adult. Is this correct, and how would one distinguish juvenile regals in this regard (ie. red sea vs pacific variant).

Not likely to get a good picture until he settles in, but the description is fairly straightforward...thanks

Mark

 

[SDguy]

At that size it should be yellow.

 

[albano]

At that size it should be yellow.

+1...

just purchased a juvenile red sea regal angel from a very reputable source.

Doesn't sound that 'reputable'/knowledgable to me!

 

[sandwi54]

Orange belly regal will never have a gray chest even in juvenile. Gray chest regale have orange belly in juvenile that turns gray when mature. So yours is indo-pacific gray chest regal

 

[albano]

Orange belly regal will never have a gray chest even in juvenile. Gray chest regale have orange belly in juvenile that turns gray when mature.

So all juvis have yellow/orange chest? I haven't seen that, unless you're talking about very small fish...which are 'never' available at LFSs

 

[humaguy]

this is from la...ime the color of the belly will not change from grey to yellow or vice versa during growth....whatever it is as a baby it will remain so...

 

[Dmorty217]

this is from la...ime the color of the belly will not change from grey to yellow or vice versa during growth....whatever it is as a baby it will remain so...

Thank you Humaguy, I was trying to post the same picture with my iPad 1 if you will and it wasn't working. That's what I get for letting the other go dead:hammer:

 

[SDguy]

Orange belly regal will never have a gray chest even in juvenile. Gray chest regale have orange belly in juvenile that turns gray when mature. So yours is indo-pacific gray chest regal

I agree. I've never seen a super tiny regal with a grey chest.

 

[Vili_Shark]

this is from la...ime the color of the belly will not change from grey to yellow or vice versa during growth....whatever it is as a baby it will remain so...

That reminds me of "before and after" diet pills commercial.

Can LA tell the difference between a Maldive and a Red Sea Juvenile regal?

When Saudi Arabia were still exporting you could get 2-3" specimens about 30pcs per shipment, they would not send other sizes unless you asked for it.
Now Red Sea Regals are more difficult to get.

 

[msaba]

thanks everyone for the responses--a little disconcerting for me to say the least...

The vendor responded to my questions with this-- "The juveniles from both regions are primarily medium orange in body coloration with faint vertical bars like adults as they mature into adults the orange fades, those from the red sea & indian ocean region develop yellow-orange under bellies gradually and as full adults light to deep under bellies."

He says to expect this color change will happen within the next 3 months...

In any case, this has been an 'educational' experience for me, I will give an update in the near future. thanks

Mark

 

[ca1ore]

I thought the only difference between a juvenile and an adult was the 'eye' spot on the side of the body? At almost 4 inches, I'd have thought your fish would be an adult already.

 

[msaba]

Actually the fish still has his eye spot...

Mark

 

[sandwi54]

The vendor responded to my questions with this-- "The juveniles from both regions are primarily medium orange in body coloration with faint vertical bars like adults as they mature into adults the orange fades, those from the red sea & indian ocean region develop yellow-orange under bellies gradually and as full adults light to deep under bellies."

He says to expect this color change will happen within the next 3 months.

That is an incorrect statement and you should challenge the vendor on that.

 

[125mph]

Interesting, I came up on this thread while reading more about regals.

About 4 years ago, I purchased a "Yellow Belly Indian Ocean Regal" from DD. It was a baby at about 1.25" and had been acclimated the director's own personal display tank. Picked it up for $399.

It's doing very well and about 3" now. However, upon closer observation, its definitely a gray chest... looking at LA's picture from this thread, it looks identical to the indo regal with the gray chest.

I guess I got ripped off? Either way, I'm still happy with the regal -- its very pretty and I'm happy its healthy and fat!...

+1...

Doesn't sound that 'reputable'/knowledgable to me!

 

[125mph]

Sold as Indian Ocean Yellow Belly... looks like gray Indo, no?

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[ThRoewer]

this is from la...ime the color of the belly will not change from grey to yellow or vice versa during growth....whatever it is as a baby it will remain so...

That's wrong. All regals start out with a clean yellow chest, but the Pacific subspecies will get a gray-blue chest when changing from juvenile to adult coloration. I observed that with my Philippine regals in the past and my Bali regal right now.
Though on Red Sea and Indian Ocean adults there can be some "graying" of the cheeks, but that may be mood related.

The only tell between Red Sea/Indian Ocean and Pacific juveniles I found is the color of the tailfin.
Red Sea and Indian Ocean juveniles have a yellowish clear tailfin while Pacific juveniles have a yellow-greenish clear tailfin.

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[ThRoewer]

Sold as Indian Ocean Yellow Belly... looks like gray Indo, no?

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That one looks like my Bali regal. It's a gray chest. While technically still Indian Ocean it's already the Indo-Pacific biogeographic region.
I bought my Bali as Sumatra yellow chest, but since the Sumatras are shipped via Bali it is possible that a mixup can happen.
My Bali Regal looked at first just like my other Sumatra Regals, only its tailfin was instead yellow more towards green. By now he has clearly gray cheeks and only a yellow stripe left along his throat. He is still small, but I expect him to have a solid gray-blue chest within a year.

BTW, that fish in the pictures also lacks the yellow tailfin - a clear indication that it is from the Indonesian or Philippine population.

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[Shanet]

That's wrong. All regals start out with a clean yellow chest, but the Pacific subspecies will get a gray-blue chest when changing from juvenile to adult coloration. I observed that with my Philippine regals in the past and my Bali regal right now.
Though on Red Sea and Indian Ocean adults there can be some "graying" of the cheeks, but that may be mood related.

The only tell between Red Sea/Indian Ocean and Pacific juveniles I found is the color of the tailfin.
Red Sea and Indian Ocean juveniles have a yellowish clear tailfin while Pacific juveniles have a yellow-greenish clear tailfin.

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Not true! I've had a few Pacific Regals and they ALL have grey/blue chests regardless of age. The only difference between juv and adult is the eye spot.

 

[ThRoewer]

Not true! I've had a few Pacific Regals and they ALL have grey/blue chests regardless of age. The only difference between juv and adult is the eye spot.

The Australian ones may be different, but we don't get those here. Though I doubt it that the juveniles are not yellow as well. You likely only saw specimen that were already in transition. They may still have the eyespot but already start changing body color.
The Indonesian and Philippine that are common here all start out yellow. A store here gets 1.5" specimen from the Philippines with some regularity and they are all yellow except for the tailfin.

This is a juvenile from Micronesia:


and this is my Bali regal:

he got a good deal more gray-blue by now.

 

[ThRoewer]

BTW, this is a very misleading picture - likely intentionally as it id for marketing purposes. The Indian Ocean specimen is an immature juvenile that hasn't fully colored up yet and the picture was taken with unfavorable light while the Red Sea specimen is a mature specimen and the picture taken to highlight the colors ideally. I've seen large mature Sumatra specimen here that looked precisely like the Red Sea regal in that picture.