I get the shaggy GHA even when my tank's water reads 0.05 ppm on my Hanna Checker. Still dosing the Brightwell LaCl.
The battle never ends.
Lanthanum chloride
- Thread starter Gary Majchrzak
- Start date
I get the shaggy GHA even when my tank's water reads 0.05 ppm on my Hanna Checker. Still dosing the Brightwell LaCl.
The battle never ends.
I have used phosfree for years without problems
Well, I got the Hannah ultra low range tester, and I had to dilute teh sample. Looks like I'm at 364 PPM
== John ==
the ULR meter says "ppb" on the front (model is 736). it reads from 0 to 200. take that number * 3.066 then divide by 1000 to get your phosphate in PPM. should be a lot lower than 364
naprestsleep
blank
A lot... Check back through the tread a few member with large tanks and large bio-loads have been using the same bottles since they started it.
iamwrasseman
New member
yes from the reading that i have done its at least one bookoo of po4 that it will remove per bottle
Looking for some advice ...
I've done 3 doses so far. In ten days, my Phosphorus (via low range Hannah PPB colorimeter) goes from about 34 to 139. Phosphate PPM listed also:
I'm diluting in a 2L soda bottle with RODI. Using 2 10 micron filter socks, and a second skimmer setup in a bucket. I dose into the 2nd skimmer bucket and sock.
Some of the rocks (base) in the tank are 15 years OLD. Bioload isn't really high, a big rabbit fish, 5 pseudoanthias, 1 6 line wrasse, 2 diamond gobies, 2 percula's, 3 shrimp 1 carpet anenomie. I feed a couple of pinches of flake food twice daily.
Coral doesn't do well, 1 small brain frag is struggling, but I"m sure it's the excessive Phosphates.
I have a skimmer and a refugium with small skimmer although the latter doesn't seem to be doing much.
I don't think it's underskimming and overfeeding, although I'll grant that I may do that.
Is that a fast rise? Should I just keep doing the Lanthanum Chloride every 2 weeks until it comes under control and I can use a Phosban reactor?
I've done 3 doses so far. In ten days, my Phosphorus (via low range Hannah PPB colorimeter) goes from about 34 to 139. Phosphate PPM listed also:
Code:
Phosphorus PPB Phospate PPM
14-Jan-12 364 1.116024
Dosed 5ml
5-Feb-12 300 0.9198
8-Feb-12 105 0.32193
Dosed 5ml
12-Feb-12 60 0.18396
22-Feb-12 139 0.426174
25-Feb-12 134 0.410844
Dosed 7ml
26-Feb-12 34 0.104244I'm diluting in a 2L soda bottle with RODI. Using 2 10 micron filter socks, and a second skimmer setup in a bucket. I dose into the 2nd skimmer bucket and sock.
Some of the rocks (base) in the tank are 15 years OLD. Bioload isn't really high, a big rabbit fish, 5 pseudoanthias, 1 6 line wrasse, 2 diamond gobies, 2 percula's, 3 shrimp 1 carpet anenomie. I feed a couple of pinches of flake food twice daily.
Coral doesn't do well, 1 small brain frag is struggling, but I"m sure it's the excessive Phosphates.
I have a skimmer and a refugium with small skimmer although the latter doesn't seem to be doing much.
I don't think it's underskimming and overfeeding, although I'll grant that I may do that.
Is that a fast rise? Should I just keep doing the Lanthanum Chloride every 2 weeks until it comes under control and I can use a Phosban reactor?
== John ==
Last edited:
Anybody try dosing lanthanum using the 20 inch brs filters and respective 10 5 or 1 micron filter insert? I was thinking using 4. Two empty and two with the filter cartridges. I plan on dosing the lanthanum via liter meter and one way valve with a tee prior to hitting the first canister. Thoughts?
Tony
Tony
csmfish
New member
I have read this whole thread last night and see that posts are far and between now as I am sure everyone has settled into a habit, made their point and moved on but I have a few questions for the pioneers upon their return.
1) I have heard of people having multiple settling setups (where the precipitate could just theoretically drop out, but, what about something like using, say, a 20, 50 or 100 micron sock with a string (or something to that degree) as a pre filter wrapped around the inlet of a maxijet 1200 in a separate incoming chamber (regulator) and then going into a 10 micron sock? Would that negate the Lanthanum attaching to bigger particles and capturing them?
COOLKID: I dont see why that would not work if you have something to elevate it and can hold its full weight filled with water. I think that most people have the filter sock holders that holds/stands only so many inches high.
I have also read that filter cartrides would work, but, they are not washable (to my knowledge), so, you are throwing out $4-$? a pop/use depending how fast they get clogged. I dont know if the particulate can be reverse flush good enough through the small hole and or if it would clog the canister filters, and, to, how much more work that would make compared to a simple filter sock. The one guy on here said he used a pool filter and that was a pain in the erse and would rather use the sock. Need more people with feed back on canisters, but, socks seem the way to go.
1) I have heard of people having multiple settling setups (where the precipitate could just theoretically drop out, but, what about something like using, say, a 20, 50 or 100 micron sock with a string (or something to that degree) as a pre filter wrapped around the inlet of a maxijet 1200 in a separate incoming chamber (regulator) and then going into a 10 micron sock? Would that negate the Lanthanum attaching to bigger particles and capturing them?
COOLKID: I dont see why that would not work if you have something to elevate it and can hold its full weight filled with water. I think that most people have the filter sock holders that holds/stands only so many inches high.
I have also read that filter cartrides would work, but, they are not washable (to my knowledge), so, you are throwing out $4-$? a pop/use depending how fast they get clogged. I dont know if the particulate can be reverse flush good enough through the small hole and or if it would clog the canister filters, and, to, how much more work that would make compared to a simple filter sock. The one guy on here said he used a pool filter and that was a pain in the erse and would rather use the sock. Need more people with feed back on canisters, but, socks seem the way to go.
I have dosed Seaklear phoshate remover (bought it on line from a pool place) into a 10 ml sock. Mixed 1-1/2 ml into a gallon of RO water. Slowly dripped it into sock over a 6-8hr period. I have done this about 4 times over a couple of months. I have not tested the phosphates but it has greatly reduced my hair algae. As far as changing the method around, I'm not so sure. This method is simple and it definately works.
Gary Majchrzak
Team RC
Paul- just a reminder: remember to check alkalinity. LaCl3 dosing depletes alkalinty and yes... this is extremely effective at reducing PO4!
csmfish
New member
I agree that is the best all around method but one thing keeps lingering in my mind.
Per Reefkeeper2:
I don't remember what the dosage was when I was using the socks. I tried different dosages at that time. I also noticed that when using the socks I could not get the phophate levels down as far as I liked, no matter how much of how often I dosed. Randy Holmes Farley said that was because there was ultra fine particulate getting through the sock and my test kit would pick that up. When I read about public aquaria using sand filters with lanthanum, I thought of using my vortex diatom filter. It worked like a charm. After a treatment using the diatom filter, my photometer would give a reading of 0. There were also no ill affects from any of my animals.
I charge the filter with diatom powder and superchar norit carbon. I take 50ml of RO/DI and mix it with 10ml of Seaklear pool phosphate remover. I have a syringe pump that injects 4ml an hour of this mixture into the diatom. My total tank volume is about 550gal.
I usually have to clean and charge the filter twice, as it will become clogged with precipitate in about 2-3 hours.
--------------
While that may be more of a pain, I have to admit I am OCD about stuff like that and I cant argue (trust me, I am trying) with a "0" reading on phosphates with that method, and, if that is so, would feel so much better about the things in my tank.
Now, this method is not for everyone for sure, but, I like to sit back on a Sat or Sun so, hanging out watching the tank for a few hours is fine with me
. Also, once I get it dialed in, I can always adjust the time schedules to an amount I administer etc............ me thinks?
Gary Majchrzak
Team RC
absolute zero PO4 is NOT recommended for reef aquaria
What is a good value? Mine's still going up
Code:
Phosphorus PPB Phospate PPM
14-Jan-12 364 1.116024
Dosed 5ml
5-Feb-12 300 0.9198
8-Feb-12 105 0.32193
Dosed 5ml
12-Feb-12 60 0.18396
22-Feb-12 139 0.426174
25-Feb-12 134 0.410844
Dosed 7ml
26-Feb-12 34 0.104244
8-Mar-12 95 0.29127I'm going to dose again. Some 16 year old base rock, my guess is that it's leaching; the last 2 weeks I have 2 skimmers (AquaEuro 250 classic and a G3).
I have not hooked up my Phosphate reactor yet.
This article says .03. I'm nowhere near that even after dosing :headwally:
What level should I shoot for?
== John ==
Gary Majchrzak
Team RC
compiled from personal observations and my research on the topic so far:
*phosphates can fuel nuisance algae growth and inhibit calcification in living reef organisms:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-09/rhf/index.php
there are many varied methods for lowering phosphates in reef aquaria and it's beyond the scope of this thread to review all of them. Chemical adsorbers and flocculents are simply a few of the options available.
*granular ferric oxide and aluminum based PO4 adsorbers can be pricey and risky to some extent if used improperly. In certain cases (especially in large aquariums) these might not be a practical option.
some suggested ideal levels for PO4 in reef aquaria:
.06ppm - .1ppm using reliable low range PO4 test kit(s)
some suggested reliable low range PO4 test kits:
Elos phosphate test kit
Hach PO-19 & Hach PO-24
Deltec/Rowa/Merck (basically all the same with a different name on each)
Hanna Photometer and/or Colorimeter (Several models and a kit is available. Thanks for the info, Tom!)
*phosphates can fuel nuisance algae growth and inhibit calcification in living reef organisms:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-09/rhf/index.php
there are many varied methods for lowering phosphates in reef aquaria and it's beyond the scope of this thread to review all of them. Chemical adsorbers and flocculents are simply a few of the options available.
*granular ferric oxide and aluminum based PO4 adsorbers can be pricey and risky to some extent if used improperly. In certain cases (especially in large aquariums) these might not be a practical option.
some suggested ideal levels for PO4 in reef aquaria:
.06ppm - .1ppm using reliable low range PO4 test kit(s)
some suggested reliable low range PO4 test kits:
Elos phosphate test kit
Hach PO-19 & Hach PO-24
Deltec/Rowa/Merck (basically all the same with a different name on each)
Hanna Photometer and/or Colorimeter (Several models and a kit is available. Thanks for the info, Tom!)
csmfish
New member
True, but, what that tells me I need to do is to grab my Hanna tester and start out real slow. Need to find how much seaklear brings down how much phos per x amount of seaklear. If I micro dose, I should be able to play around with it and learn how to drop my phos by "x" percentage, still have some phos left over and "know" it is (seaklear) all cleaned out of the system.
Then again, maybe I will be one of those "ooops, everything died, thats too much" peope, lol? :debi: I hope not
Dave & Monica
New member
Glad to see Gary keeps this thread alive. I still use LC once a month before changing out GFO. I stoped for a few months and was getting red slime/cryo again. Went back to LC, and it goes away a few days after treatment. I've been using it for about a year - tank has never looked better.
Dave & Monica
New member
My Hanna meter always reads (ULR phosphorus HI736 not the phosphate meter) between .07 and .11
Similar threads
