people who go with "almost" no Water Changes needed!

[tmz]

You can have your opinion; but it's not a practice I could remotely agree with. I
think it's unfortunate folks still avoid quarantine and preventative treatment. There is a lot of carnage in the hobby from it and it will increase if folks avoid proper reasonable precautions and treatments.There are plenty of ich threads out there if you want to argue for putting fish with ich in a tank without quarantine .the fis disease forum has a wealth of information I think we've moved off topic enough for now.

 

[tmz]

Disagreement is not bashing. Misrepresenting the positions and statements others and atrributing irrational motives to them is.IMO.

Sharing is sharing.

Selling is selling.

Sponsorship does not mean disagreement won't occur it just makes it ok to sell stuff openly and above board.

All the personal history doesn't contribute anything. This thread is not all about you.

I think others should be encouraged to share their experience and opinions with a variety of approaches to water changes or the lack of them as well as dosing and export strategies they may practice if any.

 

[OrionN]

There are Ich predators out there. It is my believe that Ich cannot reproduce in my tank. The tomites stage of Ich got heavily predated in my tank and will not spread. This is the natural way of containment of Ich.

If you put an Ich infested fish in a barren sterile aquarium, without treatment he will died. That is for sure. If you put that fish in a somewhat sterile system, where there are no natural predators of Ich to control them, they will spread and infect other fishes. In my tank, the fauna in the sand bed eat up the tomites and that is the end of it.

I really believe in a healthy eco system. The sand bed added a lot to the stability of the tank and control diseases.

 

[OrionN]

Have I bashed anybody? I just give my view and why I do the things I do. tmz and I disagree, but so what. He is a great guy and help a lot of people.
glennf and I disagree on other things. I am not calling names or bashing anybody IMO.

 

[Aquatron]

I only read the last 5 pages and believe how some disagreements are worded is bashing. I am only posting on this thread because I see a newbie building his post count in a disrespectful way......not a good way to start off usually it takes longer for us to see a members back 1/2 of a donkey side.

 

[glennf]

Disagreements are fine and normal.
It becomes bashing when you are focusing on someone by disapproving with anything he says.

 

[Standpipe1]

There are Ich predators out there. It is my believe that Ich cannot reproduce in my tank. The tomites stage of Ich got heavily predated in my tank and will not spread. This is the natural way of containment of Ich.

If you put an Ich infested fish in a barren sterile aquarium, without treatment he will died. That is for sure. If you put that fish in a somewhat sterile system, where there are no natural predators of Ich to control them, they will spread and infect other fishes. In my tank, the fauna in the sand bed eat up the tomites and that is the end of it.

I really believe in a healthy eco system. The sand bed added a lot to the stability of the tank and control diseases.

As big as I am on disease, and haven't heard this before. I gotta believe there is some truth in that.

 

[Standpipe1]

We all have opinions and who cares if people disagree.

It's not bashing, just people defending their point of view.

In the end, we're all reefers.

The only difference between you guys and myself is that my tank water is cleaner than the rest of you.

 

[Standpipe1]

Disagreements are fine and normal.
It becomes bashing when you are focusing on someone by disapproving with anything he says.

I gotta disagree!

 

[Aquarist007]

It isn't stupid to do less water changes just like it isn't stupid for you to use a skimmer or MH lighting. If it works for you then great. However, it does not mean if I replicate your system and methods mine will be successful...no more than you replicating mine.

That's a really good point. Everyone's tank is a different ecosystem even though it is a mini reef system. We can't close to imitating the real reef nor can we imitate someone's unique system.

 

[glennf]

If spawning is a sight of superb water quality and a healthy tank , mine must be super healthy i guess

My own tank breed clownfish are spawning every 14 days like clockwork since 2012

Picture was taken 1 minute ago..

 

[glennf]

Publication in 2009 in dutch reefing magazine. At that time i was still breeding clownsfish and seahorses

 

[glennf]

So even in 2009. in my breeding challenge i was already going without water changes, with great succes.

 

[glennf]

Still waiting on white 5/g bucket pics. That tells the truth about water.

Here you are, my contribution

 

[glennf]

There were about 600 clownsfish swimming in that tank.
I had 12 full occupied aquariums and countless containers and nano like tanks with phyto and zoo plankton in my home at that time.
Totaling about 3700 liters which were saltwater related.

Talk to me about saltwater crazy

 

[Standpipe1]

Here you are, my contribution

View attachment 289984

I don't believe it. He got that from the tap. What's in the bottom of that bucket?

 

[Paul B]

I disagree that not QT fish is bad. I keep marine aquarium since 1980 and never have problem with fish disease outbreak.
Corals, clams and anemones is another mater entirely.
Fish disease do not have a chance in my system. I don't add fish that is obviously sick. A few spots of Ich is fine in my tank. Ich never spread to my other fishes and just died off (the Ich) in a week or two. I have hard to keep fish and they do just fine. This works for me because I think I have a very natural balance ecosystem and the fish are very healthy.
I have a fully run reef tank to QT all my anemones, corals and clams. None of these get into my tank until they get close observation in my QT system. In the last 30+ years I got some bad pests. PMD in clams, Red bugs, Montipora eating Nudi, Clam parasitic snails, snail parasitic snails. I have not have to treat my DT system ever. Only close time was the outbreak of red flatworm in my 450 tank. However with good water management, the flatworm seem to fizzle out too.

+1 and I got the oldest tank on here and probably some of the oldest fish. I am most likely the baldest one here also. Of course instead of sea water I use damp sawdust. Anybody want to argue with me? :worried:

 

[reefwiser]

Paul you win. as always.

 

[OrionN]

If spawning is a sight of superb water quality and a healthy tank , mine must be super healthy i guess

My own tank breed clownfish are spawning every 14 days like clockwork since 2012

Picture was taken 1 minute ago..

Glenn,
Not to down play your achievement or anything but (there is away that but ) breeding clownfish have been going on since the late 70's and tank breed clownfish available comercially since at least 1980. That was the firsh salt warter fish that I killed.
You can get a pair of clown and put them in a 10 gal with a flower pot and get them to breed.
If you tell me that all of your medium to small size fish spawned in your aquarium, then I say that you have a healthy tank.
One of my goal is to keep breeding units of all my small to medium size fish in my aquarium and eventually get them to spawn. I am prety sucessful at this. Getting them to spawn and document them on video or pictures is entirely two different thing, so if you want me to proof this by provide these proof then I respectfully bowed out of this discussion.

I am not saying that if you change water then you have a healthy tank and that if you don't change water then all your fish died. What I am saying is that if you tank the best tank that use water change versus the best tank that does not do water change, or even minimal water change, chanches are that the one that use water change will be better and healthier.

 

[Aquarist007]

Glenn,
Not to down play your achievement or anything but (there is away that but ) breeding clownfish have been going on since the late 70's and tank breed clownfish available comercially since at least 1980. That was the firsh salt warter fish that I killed.
You can get a pair of clown and put them in a 10 gal with a flower pot and get them to breed.
If you tell me that all of your medium to small size fish spawned in your aquarium, then I say that you have a healthy tank.
One of my goal is to keep breeding units of all my small to medium size fish in my aquarium and eventually get them to spawn. I am prety sucessful at this. Getting them to spawn and document them on video or pictures is entirely two different thing, so if you want me to proof this by provide these proof then I respectfully bowed out of this discussion.

I am not saying that if you change water then you have a healthy tank and that if you don't change water then all your fish died. What I am saying is that if you tank the best tank that use water change versus the best tank that does not do water change, or even minimal water change, chanches are that the one that use water change will be better and healthier.

A lot of us really appreciate your inputs and they really contribute to this thread
Try not to be on the defensive ... A passionate discussion is great so let's get back to it now that the air has been cleaned on this thread