PLEASE check out your intended fish purchases here first!

[antjtc]

dottybacks,chalkbass and helfrchi ok?

dottybacks,chalkbass and helfrchi ok?

I have a 90 gal reef tank w/ live rock/30 gal sump. I have a pair of firefish, a blue spotted jawfish, small yellow tang, royal gramma, 2 false percula clowns, mandarin goby, bangaii cardinalfish, female lyretail anthia. I'm thinking of adding either a helfrechi firefish, a chalkbass, or a dottyback. I'm not sure if the helfrechi will get attacked by the firefish pair, or if the dottyback will fight w/ the royal gramma other fish. Will the chalkbass get along w/ the royal gramma?

Appreciate any thoughts. Thanks.

 

[snorvich]

So Sohol by himself as far as larger fish go? I'm still in planning stages for my tank. If I delete the Sohol otherwise I could keep a couple of hippos, Desjardinii and others I'll bet - correct?

Actually, no. Please see Reef Central's recommended tank sizes for tangs which can be found here.
In any case, if you put two sailfin tangs in your tank, one dies. Our recommended tank sizes are somewhat additive, but not linearly so. So if you put two fish whose minimum recommended tank size for one is, for example, 240 gallons, that does not mean you can put two in 240 gallons.

 

[snorvich]

I have a 90 gal reef tank w/ live rock/30 gal sump. I have a pair of firefish, a blue spotted jawfish, small yellow tang, royal gramma, 2 false percula clowns, mandarin goby, bangaii cardinalfish, female lyretail anthia. I'm thinking of adding either a helfrechi firefish, a chalkbass, or a dottyback. I'm not sure if the helfrechi will get attacked by the firefish pair, or if the dottyback will fight w/ the royal gramma other fish. Will the chalkbass get along w/ the royal gramma?

Appreciate any thoughts. Thanks.

Dottybacks are aggressive. The least aggressive one is P. fridmani but it is not a peaceful fish. Three firefish is likely to become one. Helfrichi firefish are most easily intimidated and once intimidated are likely to starve to death. You will not know if your two existing firefish are a male plus female pair for months; if they are not, one is likely to be killed. The chalkbass may or may not get along with the royal gramma as they have similar ecological niches.

 

[jonwright]

so a little clarity

so a little clarity

So with a "small" tank like a 6' 180 or so, then, it's only recommended for one tang and that's it? I know that everything I've read says that they are tough on "conspecifics" which are fish that are the same shape/species (never mind the folks that have multiple Hippos in their tanks).

So what about a Zebrasomas and an Acanthurus species, each? Or 2 Hippos (as the only tang species) in a "small" tank, like a 250?

I'm looking for reef compatible and active swimmers which brings me to the tangs.

LFS, all nearby, all have conflicting advice - much like each book, Fenner, and here. And yes, I know my mileage may vary.......

 

[snorvich]

So with a "small" tank like a 6' 180 or so, then, it's only recommended for one tang and that's it? I know that everything I've read says that they are tough on "conspecifics" which are fish that are the same shape/species (never mind the folks that have multiple Hippos in their tanks).

I assume "small" is supposed to be irony, but in the general scheme of things a six foot tank is not large. For tangs, length is very important, more so than gallonage, and for some species, an 8 foot tank is a minimum, especially when the fish matures at over a foot. For really large Naso tangs, 10 feet is a minimum, but larger even, would be better. But it is not only shape that a determinant of possible aggressive behavior, it is perceived territory and fish that occupy the same ecological niche within that perceived territory. The advice I give is designed to prevent problems and improve the odds of long term success. Of course, you are totally free to ignore that advice. Putting fish in tanks is easy, getting them out, especially herbivores, is not easy at all, unless of course, they are dead.

So what about a Zebrasomas and an Acanthurus species, each? Or 2 Hippos (as the only tang species) in a "small" tank, like a 250?

Easiest going behaviorally are the Naso group of tangs but they all get huge and really need a 10 foot tank as a minimum for the moderately sized ones, mellowest behavior are the Ctenochaetus group, zebrasoma get ornery, especially towards new/later additions, the highly active acanthurus group can be ornery but are very attractive and very active. Many of them live in surge conditions so long tanks with high flow are desirable.

I'm looking for reef compatible and active swimmers which brings me to the tangs.

Active swimmers that exceed a foot need a long tank. If you want to make your tank seem small, put an active 14 inch fish in a 72 inch tank. If they perceive they are "crowded", they will reduce the number of tankmates, and I can assure you those razor blades are very effective at doing so. Some tangs, such as clown tangs and sohals seem to do it "just because" as they mature. When young they may be docile and then a switch seems to flip . . .

LFS, all nearby, all have conflicting advice - much like each book, Fenner, and here. And yes, I know my mileage may vary.......

LFS are there to sell fish, and as such they have an inherent conflict of interest. I mostly agree with Bob Fenner, at least on behavioral issues. Scott W. Michael's book (I used to dive with him) has smaller minimum tank sizes but they really need to be revised and Live Aquaria has done so over the years. But as I said, you are more than welcome to ignore any advice I give, it is after all free.

 

[jonwright]

Not attempting to be argumentative. I'm trying to ferret out details and be clear. My little brain is being blown.

I do not want crowded fish. I don't want behavior problems or get a fish that I wil have to do something else with later due to my negligence.

With all the folks with tangs in smaller tanks I didn't expect to get an 8' tank. Won't hurt.

So even with an 8' er a sohol would need to be by himself or not with other tangs? He would most likely leave clown fish a pygmie angels alone?

 

[snorvich]

Not attempting to be argumentative. I'm trying to ferret out details and be clear. My little brain is being blown.

I do not want crowded fish. I don't want behavior problems or get a fish that I wil have to do something else with later due to my negligence.

With all the folks with tangs in smaller tanks I didn't expect to get an 8' tank. Won't hurt.

So even with an 8' er a sohol would need to be by himself or not with other tangs? He would most likely leave clown fish a pygmie angels alone?

That is an interesting question. My educated guess is that it would leave all small fish alone. But in the long run, not safe with large angels or any tangs.

 

[karasuyukito]

Total newb! As such, I'm sure this stocking list looks odd. However, I've picked fish out of a list that I can order from my LFS, as I don't trust online shipments of live fish. I've also been having an interesting time of trying to find correct size requirements for some fish, so excuse me if I've totally chosen the wrong fish.

First saltwater tank. 29 gallon with 10 gallon refuge. (Cheato, Dragon's Breath, Ogo, and one other. But I'm pretty sure the Cheato has out competed the other three in growing super fast.) Approx ~ 35 total gallon capacity. Tank is kept at a steady 78 F. 30 lbs crushed argonite sand with about 35 lbs rock. Lights are 2 T5's, Actinic 420 and 10,000K.

Fish:
-1-2 Clownfish
Arg, I know Ocellaris are really aggressive, but the only other clown I like visually are Maroon, which are supposedly worse? Is it even plausible to have a type of clownfish (singular or pair) in this setup? True Percula maybe? I like these a bit.
-3 Stripe Damsel
-Neon Damsel (Can I have two different types of damsel in one tank? If not, which is better?)
-Firefish
-Bi-color Dottyback
-Hifin Red Banded Goby

I'm not even sure how many fish I can have in a tank this size. More, less? Any suggestions for me incase some/none of these actually work? For a clean up crew, I was just going to follow reefcleaners.com's snail only for this size tank's list.

Coral:
Zoas, hammer, mushrooms, duncan, open brain, others I haven't thought of.
Any other suggestions? At first I thought my lights were awesome, now I'm thinking through research that I won't be able to grow as much as I'd like.

Don't sugar coat it, lol. Seriously, I want a successful tank more than being butt hurt on the internet.

 

[snorvich]

Total newb! As such, I'm sure this stocking list looks odd. However, I've picked fish out of a list that I can order from my LFS, as I don't trust online shipments of live fish. I've also been having an interesting time of trying to find correct size requirements for some fish, so excuse me if I've totally chosen the wrong fish.

Well, first of all do not "trust" any vendor of fish, quarantine (see my blog for a good quarantine protocol) all fish. LFS are not necessarily better than online vendors and neither quarantine properly. LFS advice, however is suspect because they have an inherent conflict of interest. They want to sell you fish. We want you to be successful with no monetary advantage from our advice.

First saltwater tank. 29 gallon with 10 gallon refuge. (Cheato, Dragon's Breath, Ogo, and one other. But I'm pretty sure the Cheato has out competed the other three in growing super fast.) Approx ~ 35 total gallon capacity. Tank is kept at a steady 78 F. 30 lbs crushed argonite sand with about 35 lbs rock. Lights are 2 T5's, Actinic 420 and 10,000K.

Fish:
-1-2 Clownfish
Arg, I know Ocellaris are really aggressive, but the only other clown I like visually are Maroon, which are supposedly worse? Is it even plausible to have a type of clownfish (singular or pair) in this setup? True Percula maybe? I like these a bit.

Sexually mature clownfish will be aggressive but A. ocellaris or A. percula will be the least aggressive. GSM (gold stripe maroon) will be the most aggressive and would not allow any other fish to exist in a 29 gallon tank

-3 Stripe Damsel No damsels or dottybacks in a small tank; they are very aggressive
-Neon Damsel (Can I have two different types of damsel in one tank? If not, which is better?)
-Firefish excellent fish
-Bi-color Dottyback as mentioned above, no dottybacks
-Hifin Red Banded Goby great

I'm not even sure how many fish I can have in a tank this size.

4-5 small behaviorally compatible fish

More, less? Any suggestions for me incase some/none of these actually work? For a clean up crew, I was just going to follow reefcleaners.com's snail only for this size tank's list.

snail only is terrific

Coral:
Zoas, hammer, mushrooms, duncan, open brain, others I haven't thought of.

this thread is ONLY about marine fish compatibility, but I am more than happy to revisit any stocking list you come up with

Any other suggestions? At first I thought my lights were awesome, now I'm thinking through research that I won't be able to grow as much as I'd like.

Don't sugar coat it, lol. Seriously, I want a successful tank more than being butt hurt on the internet.

Do not worry, I am always kind, but very straight forward; no sugar coating here. One of the reasons this thread is so highly rated.

 

[RaineyDays]

Yellow fish recommendation

Yellow fish recommendation

My tank info is in the signature below. Presently my tank is 3 months old and I have 2 ocellaris clowns and 2 small LPS coral frags. Looking to get more LPS and soft corals down the road. My CUC consists of 2 turbos, 2 astrea, 4 nass., 3 scarlet crabs and 1 cleaner shrimp.

I would really like to get a yellow fish to add some colour to the tank. I would love a yellow tang but alas the tank is too small. Would you recommend a yellow clown goby or perhaps a yellow wrasse for this tank? Or perhaps another yellow fish that would be compatible with my setup? I am not sure if I will ever get a 4th fish; 3 may be the limit. I do have a growing pod population and the clowns don't seem too interested in them.

Any advice would be appreciated!

 

[kevinrf]

75g, 40gsump

Is this too many fish for my tank?

(1) melanarus wrasse
(1) ora black & white clown
(1) extreme snowflake clown
(1) neondotty back
(1) longnose hawk fish
(2) sleeper gobies
(1) barnacle blenny
(1) midas blenny
(1) spotted madarin
(2) harlequin shrimp
(1) scarlet shrimp

 

[snorvich]

My tank info is in the signature below. Included for my benefit:

Current tank info: 30g long, Tunze nano & 2 Koralias pwhds, Tunze skimmer & ATO, T5s 4 X 39w, 25lbs LR and a whole lot of patience.


Presently my tank is 3 months old and I have 2 ocellaris clowns and 2 small LPS coral frags. Looking to get more LPS and soft corals down the road. My CUC consists of 2 turbos, 2 astrea, 4 nass., 3 scarlet crabs and 1 cleaner shrimp.

I would really like to get a yellow fish to add some colour to the tank. I would love a yellow tang but alas the tank is too small. Would you recommend a yellow clown goby or perhaps a yellow wrasse for this tank? Or perhaps another yellow fish that would be compatible with my setup? I am not sure if I will ever get a 4th fish; 3 may be the limit. I do have a growing pod population and the clowns don't seem too interested in them.

Any advice would be appreciated!

While I do not recommend fish for a variety of reasons, a yellow clown goby would be fine.

 

[snorvich]

75g, 40gsump

Is this too many fish for my tank?

(1) melanarus wrasse
(1) ora black & white clown
(1) extreme snowflake clown
(1) neondotty back extremely aggressive
(1) longnose hawk fish NOT shrimp safe
(2) sleeper gobies will deplete your sand bed of beneficial organisms then starve to death
(1) barnacle blenny two blennies may not coexist long term
(1) midas blenny
(1) spotted madarin
(2) harlequin shrimp
(1) scarlet shrimp

I would not keep that number of fish in that sized tank; however, the bioload is likely to be ok

 

[RaineyDays]

While I do not recommend fish for a variety of reasons, a yellow clown goby would be fine.

Thanks very much

 

[karasuyukito]

Do not worry, I am always kind, but very straight forward; no sugar coating here. One of the reasons this thread is so highly rated.

Yup, totally get that about the LFS thing. As for the list part, I just had a list of the fish they could order, and from that I chose myself. I don't listen to them on their salt recommendations anyway, as the owner isn't quite as knowledgeable as I am in freshwater, at all. So I assume his salt is lacking a bit too, on the safe side. All of my marine inhabitants will be quarantined, period. However, I read your quarantine process, but I actually don't understand it. Can I message you (or something, as I'm new to this site) about it? I was originally going to follow this for the most part:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/quarantining-marine-fish-made-simple

For quarantine. EXCEPT the drip acclimation parts, yikes. I know why that's bad, lol. I've already purchased the medication even. XD But I won't be able to even set up my QT tank until next week, thankfully. So I have time to review how I'm to do it.

So, I can have Ocellaris, sweet! And I will get them as juveniles. When I purchase them, should I BUY and QT 2 at the same time since I'm to have a pair, or just buy one (and QT) them one after the other?

2 Ocellaris, 1 Firefish, 1 Hifin Red Banded Goby. Is there a specific order these fish should be introduced in? I'm curious as to if I need to buy them in a certain order or not.

 

[jonwright]

Yet another combination

For generally 6' tank (either 24 or 27" width and height)

In order of preference (not necessarily addition)

1. Clowns. Gotta have some clowns. Maybe 4 Oscellaris? If I did a yellow stripe maroon (biaculateous) I understand that most likely only one would do.
2. Flame Angel (and I also assume that no other min angels should be done, right?)
3. Small Tang (still looking at who that might be)
4. Sixline wrasse

I've done a lot of research and it's tough to figure all this out without a handy "reef builder wizard" that I can do online.

some schooling fish would be cool - I assume that bannerfish wouldn't fit in with the aggressive nature of the Flame angel?

 

[MoonPie88]

Hello again,

Tank 30gal, 9 months, mostly LPS no SPS

current Stock:
1x Hectors Goby
2x A. ocellaris
1x A. randalli + pistol shrimp

Would like to add one more fish, but a reall eye catcher.

Cirrhilabrus aurantidorsalis (mostly recommended for bigger tanks, but would only grow 3 1/2 " and I saw the fish in stock yesterday *.* my absolute favorite fish)

or

Midas Blenny ( over 6", I think he will grow too big for the tank?)

atrosalarias fuscus (still too big?)

Escenius stigmatura (think this would work?)

 

[snorvich]

Yup, totally get that about the LFS thing. As for the list part, I just had a list of the fish they could order, and from that I chose myself. I don't listen to them on their salt recommendations anyway, as the owner isn't quite as knowledgeable as I am in freshwater, at all. So I assume his salt is lacking a bit too, on the safe side. All of my marine inhabitants will be quarantined, period. However, I read your quarantine process, but I actually don't understand it. Can I message you (or something, as I'm new to this site) about it?

Unfortunately, it is really not feasible for me to handle questions via PM (although most of the stickies in the Fish Disease forum were written by me; they should however, be self-explanatory) but there is a lot of useful information in the Fish Diseases Forum.

I was originally going to follow this for the most part:

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/quarantining-marine-fish-made-simple

For quarantine. EXCEPT the drip acclimation parts, yikes. I know why that's bad, lol. I've already purchased the medication even. XD But I won't be able to even set up my QT tank until next week, thankfully. So I have time to review how I'm to do it.

So, I can have Ocellaris, sweet! And I will get them as juveniles. When I purchase them, should I BUY and QT 2 at the same time since I'm to have a pair, or just buy one (and QT) them one after the other?

Buy two at a time and be sure to get small ones; they will sort out who becomes female and who will be male. If you are really into clownfish, get the book Clownfish by Joyce Wilkersen.

2 Ocellaris, 1 Firefish, 1 Hifin Red Banded Goby. Is there a specific order these fish should be introduced in? I'm curious as to if I need to buy them in a certain order or not.

I would get the clownfish, then the firefish and finally the goby.

 

[snorvich]

Yet another combination

For generally 6' tank (either 24 or 27" width and height)

In order of preference (not necessarily addition)

1. Clowns. Gotta have some clowns. Maybe 4 Oscellaris? If I did a yellow stripe maroon (biaculateous) I understand that most likely only one would do. You get one pair of clowns; any more will be killed. A. ocellaris is the least aggressive once bonded and sexually mature. A GSM clown is very ornery and will control about 50 gallons of tank space
2. Flame Angel (and I also assume that no other min angels should be done, right?) Not true. In your large 180 gallon tank, you can easily do three of them
3. Small Tang (still looking at who that might be)
4. Sixline wrasse Avoid. They are a PITA and very difficult to remove once you realize you should not have put one in.

I've done a lot of research and it's tough to figure all this out without a handy "reef builder wizard" that I can do online.

There is no "reef builder wizard" available. Bob Fenner gets a lot of traffic, however, and this thread you are on now has been going a LONG time and I have literally done thousands of these.

some schooling fish would be cool - I assume that bannerfish wouldn't fit in with the aggressive nature of the Flame angel?

Yeah, well everyone wants schooling fish. There is only one that is available (red spot cardinals) and they are tricky, very small, and susceptible to being eaten by other fish. All the "other" ones people think are schooling, don't and many don't even shoal.

 

[snorvich]

Hello again,

Tank 30gal, 9 months, mostly LPS no SPS

current Stock:
1x Hectors Goby
2x A. ocellaris
1x A. randalli + pistol shrimp

Would like to add one more fish, but a reall eye catcher.

My advice is below.

Cirrhilabrus aurantidorsalis (mostly recommended for bigger tanks, but would only grow 3 1/2 " and I saw the fish in stock yesterday *.* my absolute favorite fish)

or

Midas Blenny ( over 6", I think he will grow too big for the tank?)

atrosalarias fuscus (still too big?)

Escenius stigmatura (think this would work?)

This is the only one I would suggest in this sized tank