Silent and Failsafe Overflow System
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jb61264
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I just layed that side of the tank on the ground and set the overflow perfectly in place exactly where I needed it...worked great. You may not have the means to in which case your method should work ok
RocketSurgeon
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I marked mine with a pen and painters tape, and then clamped it with blocks.
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RocketSurgeon
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Not necessarily smoother, but a cleaner look.
i had a couple questions on the overflow i would like to try. i know it's been done, but i really want to know more about proper dimensions. first, i would like to use an external box so i wont lose space in the tank. i would like to have a small coast to coast internal overflow. how small can this be? i believe you are supposed to leave 1.5" from the top when drilling holes correct and another bits width between holes? this means my internal overflow would be atleast 3" vertically long and an inch horizontally? any chance of using another material for the internal besides glass(my tank is glass)? now how large does the external have to be? is bigger better or can it just be large enough to fit the 3 pipes? will silicone alone support this or is it better to support the box with something? thank you and thank you bean!!!!
SkyReef
New member
Why Not Have Returns Beneath Overflow, but Hard-Pipe to Higher Water Level?
Why Not Have Returns Beneath Overflow, but Hard-Pipe to Higher Water Level?
Hey, all:
I finished BeanAnimal's overflow stand pipes, now I'm working on the return lines. I'm trying to figure out the best aesthetics for the return lines to the tank. Much has been recommended to have the return lines go over the top of the tank, to avoid potential siphon-flood-sump-and-house-and-home problems. I get it.
But why not have the return line come through the back wall, below the floor of the overflow, via a bulkhead near the left and right sides? Then, the lines could run along the soffit/underside of the overflow box floor, then turn up and proceed nearly to the top of the water line, where a directional flow device could be attached? If it's all hard-piped and glued sturdily, there should not be a siphon-backwash at the point of the bulkhead. Instead, in the event of a pump failure, the most that would backwash down to the sump is a slim layer of water near the top--probably no more than a half a gallon or so.
This might be more aesthetically pleasing than having the return lines descend from above. Here is a very crude drawing of what I am talking about, and the return line is colored black. (The perspective of the drawing is inaccurate because the return line will lie directly against the wall of the tank. As such, the drawing should have been rendered to show the overflow standing pipes closer to the viewer than the return line. However, it is what it is because I didn't want to futz with the drawing too much. I just wanted to get it out there quickly for your review. The drawing gives the basic idea).
Here's the basic plumbing:
(1) The single, one-inch return line would leave the sump, go through an external pump, and then migrate upwards along the back wall of the tank, up to a height just below the level of the floor of the overflow box,
(2) At this point, the single, one-inch pipe would branch left and right, into two 3/4-inch, hard-PVC, return lines, until the pipes made it to nearly the side of the tank, far left and far right;
(3) At this point, the two 3/4-inch return lines would penetrate the back wall of the tank, beneath the level of the overflow box, through two 3/4-inch bulkheads;
(4) After the point of penetration, the 3/4" hard plumbing would extend straight out, in the direction of the front of the tank, directly beneath the overflow box;
(5) At the point where the pipes reaches the front edge of the overflow box, they would change direction, turning straight up, and terminating near the surface of the water, with flow directors causing the water to slightly agitate the surface of the water, for good aeration;
(6) the black pipes will be somewhat obscured by the floor of the overflow box, and also they will blend into the black background of the tank (until coralline algae growth changes the coloration pattern, I suspect).
Am I missing something basic here? Will I run into problems with this idea? I should learn the answer before I start drilling more holes in the back glass panel. Your advice would be most helpful.
Thanks!
Why Not Have Returns Beneath Overflow, but Hard-Pipe to Higher Water Level?
Hey, all:
I finished BeanAnimal's overflow stand pipes, now I'm working on the return lines. I'm trying to figure out the best aesthetics for the return lines to the tank. Much has been recommended to have the return lines go over the top of the tank, to avoid potential siphon-flood-sump-and-house-and-home problems. I get it.
But why not have the return line come through the back wall, below the floor of the overflow, via a bulkhead near the left and right sides? Then, the lines could run along the soffit/underside of the overflow box floor, then turn up and proceed nearly to the top of the water line, where a directional flow device could be attached? If it's all hard-piped and glued sturdily, there should not be a siphon-backwash at the point of the bulkhead. Instead, in the event of a pump failure, the most that would backwash down to the sump is a slim layer of water near the top--probably no more than a half a gallon or so.
This might be more aesthetically pleasing than having the return lines descend from above. Here is a very crude drawing of what I am talking about, and the return line is colored black. (The perspective of the drawing is inaccurate because the return line will lie directly against the wall of the tank. As such, the drawing should have been rendered to show the overflow standing pipes closer to the viewer than the return line. However, it is what it is because I didn't want to futz with the drawing too much. I just wanted to get it out there quickly for your review. The drawing gives the basic idea).
Here's the basic plumbing:
(1) The single, one-inch return line would leave the sump, go through an external pump, and then migrate upwards along the back wall of the tank, up to a height just below the level of the floor of the overflow box,
(2) At this point, the single, one-inch pipe would branch left and right, into two 3/4-inch, hard-PVC, return lines, until the pipes made it to nearly the side of the tank, far left and far right;
(3) At this point, the two 3/4-inch return lines would penetrate the back wall of the tank, beneath the level of the overflow box, through two 3/4-inch bulkheads;
(4) After the point of penetration, the 3/4" hard plumbing would extend straight out, in the direction of the front of the tank, directly beneath the overflow box;
(5) At the point where the pipes reaches the front edge of the overflow box, they would change direction, turning straight up, and terminating near the surface of the water, with flow directors causing the water to slightly agitate the surface of the water, for good aeration;
(6) the black pipes will be somewhat obscured by the floor of the overflow box, and also they will blend into the black background of the tank (until coralline algae growth changes the coloration pattern, I suspect).
Am I missing something basic here? Will I run into problems with this idea? I should learn the answer before I start drilling more holes in the back glass panel. Your advice would be most helpful.
Thanks!
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RocketSurgeon
New member
Six 90 degree elbows create lots of back pressure on return pump.
SkyReef
New member
Hi, RocketSureon. Thanks for your reply.
That's a good point. I'm told that I have an oversized pump (IWAKI external MD-40RT) to circulate water through a rather small system, comprised of a 28-gallon Nanocube (main tank) + a 12-gal. BioCube (side tank operating as a dedicated refugium). I'm told that this pump can overcome a lot of head pressure, created by 90-degree elbows, for example. Yet I see your point. Maybe I could aim to use 45-degree elbows where I can, to reduce back pressure. (Also, I may be miscounting here, but I think there are 5 elbows: (1) from the center to branches x 1; (2) before entering the bulkhead from the outside x 2; (3) turning up in front of the overflow box x 2=5. I think the drawing makes it look like there are 2 center-to-branch elbows, but it's a single pipe that looks like two pipes in a bad drawing.)
It just seems cleaner to obscure the return line under the Coast-to-Coast overflow box, to have it discreetly rise up along the corners of the overflow, to reach their termination points, in the corners fronting the overflow box, with directional nozzles. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm imagining an over-the-top return that descends into the water in front of the overflow box, as being more of an eyesore than it will truly be. In this regard, I picture an over-the-top return as being either: (1) a single return line in the center of the tank, branching into two, aimed termination points near the center of the tank; or (2) two separate return lines rising and falling near sides of the tank and terminating near the sides of the tank.
I'm just concerned about aesthetics and hope that a hard plumb through the back wall is sound, engineering-wise. Technically, would the plan work?
RocketSurgeon
New member
The plan will work. Many have shortened the coast to coast to allow the returns to be plumbed on the side next to the box rather than under the box.
Remember, the more holes you create, the more chance of a leak down the road.
I have mine plumbed over the top, and I don't mind the look at all. I painted the pvc black. I'll see if I can locate a couple pics and post.
I saw one the other day that drills through the glass and the box, essentially plumbing through the box, rather than under it. All of these are viable options.
Remember, the more holes you create, the more chance of a leak down the road.
I have mine plumbed over the top, and I don't mind the look at all. I painted the pvc black. I'll see if I can locate a couple pics and post.
I saw one the other day that drills through the glass and the box, essentially plumbing through the box, rather than under it. All of these are viable options.
SkyReef
New member
Hi, RocketSurgeon:
Thanks for your reply. Good points. My Coast-to-Coast is already done, so no ability to input on the sides there. That more holes would present more risk of future leaks seems like a good concern. You're probably spot on with the over-the-top returns not looking bad. In such a scenario, though, I would be limited to raising the hood off the top of the NanoCube tank. I could get those clip-mounts for the hood, so that wouldn't be a big deal.
Pictures would be great, if you could post them.
Thanks.
RocketSurgeon
New member
I started off with white pvc. I'm running soft plumbing up the the bottom of the display. I have since taken it apart and painted it black.
I couldn't quickly find a current picture with it all painted black with the black background.
I need to relocate my fan to the sump and get it off the Display. The fan helps tremendously keeping things cool.
I couldn't quickly find a current picture with it all painted black with the black background.
I need to relocate my fan to the sump and get it off the Display. The fan helps tremendously keeping things cool.
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SkyReef
New member
Hi, RocketSurgeon:
Thanks for posting the pictures. Great pics. Very nice job on your tank! I have a question about the the 45-degree elbows + short PVC pipes that you have as the return-lines in each corner of your tank. I notice that the pipe openings for the return lines are not completely submerged in the water. Was this placement by design? How come you opt not to completely sink the opening in the water? Does it make noise if not completely submerged?
Thanks.
Thanks for posting the pictures. Great pics. Very nice job on your tank! I have a question about the the 45-degree elbows + short PVC pipes that you have as the return-lines in each corner of your tank. I notice that the pipe openings for the return lines are not completely submerged in the water. Was this placement by design? How come you opt not to completely sink the opening in the water? Does it make noise if not completely submerged?
Thanks.
RocketSurgeon
New member
I wanted limited siphon upon power outages.
I turned on my return pump and watched the water run through the pipe. I used 1" pipe. I have the lines submerged till they do not splash, create bubbles, or make noise. Just so happen, they are barely out of the water. The 45 elbows touching the water are not glued, so they can be adjusted easily if need be. Upon power outage, I only draw back water in the lines. I do not siphon water from the tank.
The other day, I increased return flow, and adjusted the elbows deeper into the water. The top of the return line is just below the top of the water line.
Hope that helps.
SkyReef
New member
Thanks, RocketSurgeon. That does help.
SkyReef
New member
A Mockup of Over-The-Top Plumbing on BeanAnimal's Design
A Mockup of Over-The-Top Plumbing on BeanAnimal's Design
Howdy:
Over the last few posts, I've wondered if it is workable to plumb the return lines on Bean's system through the back wall, under the soffit of the overflow box, turned up to terminate just below surface of the water. My concern mainly arose from the perception that over-the-top return lines might present as an eyesore. However, it seems like some good counterpoints were raised against drilling more holes, while RocketSurgeon showed that over-the-top return lines are not an eyesore, with his pictures.
In response, I have attempted to do some crude mockups of what it might look like. Here are three pictures of my NanoCube 28-gallon aquarium, in the final stages of plumbing BeanAnimal's design.
Note that there are two over-the-top return lines positioned over the front of the overflow box. This is not actually plumbed yet; the PVC is just loose-fitted, unconnected to the sump, and draped on the top of the tank.
I am going to mull over how this looks. So far, I tend to agree that it doesn't look so bad. If I ultimately choose this over-the-top design, I will raise the hood and paint the PVC return-lines black. Hence, they will probably look better in the future than they do now, with glaring white serving as an unwanted, stark contrast.
Do you all think the over-the-top positioning of return lines looks bad? I tried placing these far apart, at the corners, but aesthetically, they look better when positioned in the middle third of the tank, aligned in the two spaces between the three bulkheads. I suspect my flow diverters would aim outward, toward the sides of the tanks. In this regard, if I use powerheads on the side of the tank, it would create a nice cross-flow of currents.
Your thoughts and comments would be most helpful.
Thanks.
A Mockup of Over-The-Top Plumbing on BeanAnimal's Design
Howdy:
Over the last few posts, I've wondered if it is workable to plumb the return lines on Bean's system through the back wall, under the soffit of the overflow box, turned up to terminate just below surface of the water. My concern mainly arose from the perception that over-the-top return lines might present as an eyesore. However, it seems like some good counterpoints were raised against drilling more holes, while RocketSurgeon showed that over-the-top return lines are not an eyesore, with his pictures.
In response, I have attempted to do some crude mockups of what it might look like. Here are three pictures of my NanoCube 28-gallon aquarium, in the final stages of plumbing BeanAnimal's design.
Note that there are two over-the-top return lines positioned over the front of the overflow box. This is not actually plumbed yet; the PVC is just loose-fitted, unconnected to the sump, and draped on the top of the tank.
I am going to mull over how this looks. So far, I tend to agree that it doesn't look so bad. If I ultimately choose this over-the-top design, I will raise the hood and paint the PVC return-lines black. Hence, they will probably look better in the future than they do now, with glaring white serving as an unwanted, stark contrast.
Do you all think the over-the-top positioning of return lines looks bad? I tried placing these far apart, at the corners, but aesthetically, they look better when positioned in the middle third of the tank, aligned in the two spaces between the three bulkheads. I suspect my flow diverters would aim outward, toward the sides of the tanks. In this regard, if I use powerheads on the side of the tank, it would create a nice cross-flow of currents.
Your thoughts and comments would be most helpful.
Thanks.
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I am planning on going with an external box with a small 1 -2" weir on the inside. Question is the box will have 3 1.5" holes, can I get away with drilling only 2 1.5" holes in the tank for the water to go over the weir into the box? I would like to keep the drilling down to a minimum. The tank is a 265, the overflow will be on one end. So the box will be roughly 20" wide and the weir will be c2c so about 23" wide if that makes a difference
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marius880
New member
wow.. i installed this overflow style in mine last night. i did not get a chance to turn it on, becasue i still needed to finish the sump part. i am so nervous that it might not be dead silent. 
i followed the instructions, the only thing i did different is add some 45 to the open chanel and emergency and 2 -45* in the main siphon one. my 1.5 pvc wil go to the basement. i hope it will work. i will post pictures tonight. i am worried that the 45* might mess up, and it wont be identical to beans. question: my pump will give about 2000 gph. i know that the 1.5 can handle it alone... will it still be silent?
i followed the instructions, the only thing i did different is add some 45 to the open chanel and emergency and 2 -45* in the main siphon one. my 1.5 pvc wil go to the basement. i hope it will work. i will post pictures tonight. i am worried that the 45* might mess up, and it wont be identical to beans. question: my pump will give about 2000 gph. i know that the 1.5 can handle it alone... will it still be silent?RocketSurgeon
New member
Ever since I installed my gate valve, I can't hear mine over the skimmer.
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