Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

Thanks for the clarification. I think I will be fine as long as I remember to look at what the overflow is doing everyday and make sure the dry line is staying dry. I have already purchased the gate valves so this should not be a problem. But I am still tempted to change things up and go c2c. Seems like a shame after spending so much on the overflow already though.
Dave
 
adova said:
I have been noticing that the water height in the overflow box changes over time without any adjustment to the valves. The variable that does change (as I am still setting up) is the sump level where the return pump is located.

Can the sump level affect the pump output and hence the overflow water height?
Click to expand...

Yes it can. The variable is called the Net Suction Head Pressure Available. This defines the water height or pressure head above the pump inlet. Depending on the water level, the static lift the pump needs to overcome either increases or decreases, with decreasing or increasing water level, respectively. This of course will cause a small variation in pump output.
 
Reefer PT said:
Thanks for the clarification. I think I will be fine as long as I remember to look at what the overflow is doing everyday and make sure the dry line is staying dry. I have already purchased the gate valves so this should not be a problem. But I am still tempted to change things up and go c2c. Seems like a shame after spending so much on the overflow already though.
Dave
Click to expand...

My advisory for going with a "Herbie" rather than a Bean, is predicated on not having to do major modifications to the tank itself. By far the ideal setup would be to remove the current overflow(s), plug existing holes with capped bulkheads, install a C2C overflow, drill three holes out the top/back of the tank, and go BA. The effort is worthwhile, but not many are willing to put forth the effort. I encourage folks to buy "blank slate" tanks, rather than "reef ready" tanks. That way, you don't have the added chore of undoing the "limits" placed by the manufacturer.
 
OK some pics.

Below the waterline



Above the waterline


Looks like it's time to take a toothbrush to the gutter guard! :eek2:
 
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Great video! The only thing I would recommend is lowering the OC so that the opening on the top of the pipe is below the level of the emergency. You really want this to engage before the water gets over the emergency. Also you might put the cap back on, leave the gasket off, and drill a few holes in it so that it allows air to intrude.

Looks like the placement of the pass-through bulkheads works pretty good, I thought you would get more bubbles than you were at the 2000 and 700 GPH levels (which is what I have seen).

Very good to see this in action - the emergency kicks in and handles the full 3000 GPH very quickly, with what appears to be only 1" of water over it.

Great demo! Thanks for posting!
 
Turbo,
I adjusted the OC up on the higher flow rate in order to submerge the bulkhead. With the water below it, it made more bubbles. I plan on running it at around 1500-2000 GPH which I feel was a good sweet spot and was completely silent. Around there I can run the pipe lower. Yea, the pipe being completely open does make a gurgling noise, so I will probably do as you instructed. I may use the airline trick everyone uses. That would allow me to set my water running height and the height that the siphon kicks in independent of each other. I also plan on making a lid to fit over the whole box. As far as the no bubbles, I think the secret is the overflow box. At 2000 GPH, the water flows over so nicely that it sticks to the wall of the box and doesn't make any gurgling or bubbles.
 
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shaggss said:
Hi Uncle

Is this the right stuff?



If so should it look like this or is this a bad bunch?

Click to expand...

I've used something similar on iron pipe for gas lines, and on copper lines for my air compressor lines running through my garage. Mine was yellow, but it looked lumpy like that also. Still hasn't leaked in three years. On the canister it said it was good for PVC as well.
 
You can also put a 90 degree JG fitting on the OC plug, then take a piece of tubing that has a slight bend to it and push that in there, so that the tubing is pointing down, and then the tubing will control the point at which the OC converts to siphon.
 
Floyd R Turbo said:
Great video! The only thing I would recommend is lowering the OC so that the opening on the top of the pipe is below the level of the emergency. You really want this to engage before the water gets over the emergency. Also you might put the cap back on, leave the gasket off, and drill a few holes in it so that it allows air to intrude.

Looks like the placement of the pass-through bulkheads works pretty good, I thought you would get more bubbles than you were at the 2000 and 700 GPH levels (which is what I have seen).

Very good to see this in action - the emergency kicks in and handles the full 3000 GPH very quickly, with what appears to be only 1" of water over it.

Great demo! Thanks for posting!
Click to expand...

Read what I made bold. I was under the impression that the air line, or in this case, the top part of the p-trap was supposed to be above the emergency. At least that has been my understanding.
 
rickztahone said:
Read what I made bold. I was under the impression that the air line, or in this case, the top part of the p-trap was supposed to be above the emergency. At least that has been my understanding.
Click to expand...

I have read that as well, but I can see benefits to both situations. Putting it below the emergency will make it kick in sooner, maybe keeping the emergency from being used at all. In that setup, the emergency would probably only see water on start up or if both the siphon and OC were clogged. The only benefit I can see of having it go down the emergency first would be that it will make noise to warn you that the siphon is clogged. Although I believe that if your OC is constantly starting a siphon and purging, then you will hear it anyways.
 
Well ideally you want the airline to be at the maximum desired level of the water in the DT, I believe, for the standard BA setup.

For the version with the pipes in an external box, not matter how that is done, I believe the preferred method is to strap it to the top of the emergency drain (facing down) so the the OC kicks in, or at least starts to, before the emergency kicks in. The idea being that the E is the 3rd drain to engage (in full) if necessary. To the OC converts (or starts to convert) to a siphon when the water level gets to the point of reaching the E drain.

Regardless, your setup appears to be working pretty well so it's really kind of nit-picking I guess.
 
rickztahone said:
Read what I made bold. I was under the impression that the air line, or in this case, the top part of the p-trap was supposed to be above the emergency. At least that has been my understanding.
Click to expand...

Yes, that is how it was originally designed. With the original design, as the water level rises the following happen:
  1. Siphon channel kicks in (noisy d/t air)
  2. Open channel kicks in
  3. Emergency channel kicks in
  4. Air line occludes, converting open channel from a Durso to a full, unrestricted siphon. The flow dramatically increases and rapidly empties the overflow.
On startup, the water level normally stops rising between 3 & 4. This maintains a head of pressure on the siphon channel, allowing it to purge the air bubbles. As this happens, it gets quieter and more efficient d/t the lack of air bubbles and the water level then drops below the E channel and stabilizes.

If the OC kicks over to a full siphon, it will frequently drain the overflow to the point that the siphon starts entraining air. The OC will then switch back over to a lower flow Durso once the airline is not under water, but the siphon never fully purges.

Depending on the configuration, some systems may purge air before the E channel kicks in. In the system Floyd has with the p-trap, the OC does not instantly convert over to a full siphon the way it does with Bean's original design, so having the emergency above the air inlet for the OC may work since the OC does not totally purge the overflow; I don't know for sure on this point.
 
thejuggernaut said:
I've used something similar on iron pipe for gas lines, and on copper lines for my air compressor lines running through my garage. Mine was yellow, but it looked lumpy like that also. Still hasn't leaked in three years. On the canister it said it was good for PVC as well.
Click to expand...

Haven't used that stuff, but I've seen others that are lumpy, so you may be fine.
 
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