Testing for bacterioplankton?

Timfish said:
Not having anyway to test the microbial populations in my systems I'll have to take Feldman's research on faith that my systems without skimmers are closer to wild populations than systems with skimmers. From experience I know having nuisance algae problems is not caused by PO4 and nitrate and can be corrected without changing thier levels. The research on DOC and the coral holobiont by many researchers, Rohwer's book is a very good introduction, is the only science I've found that offers an explanation why this is so. And I know from experience my systems without skimmers are more resilient and should outlive me.
Click to expand...

I still haven't been convinced that a skimmer is anywhere near efficient enough to be detrimental to our tiny closed systems. You do have a great looking tank. A good data point. PaulB also has a great looking very long running tank that has outlasted some with a skimmer on it. Another good data point. Glennf has a great looking tank that's been running a while and does no water changes but uses heavy mechanical filtration and a skimmer. Another good data point.

So many ways to do things in this hobby.

If anything, I did read that book btw and thanks it was great, my skimmer helps with pH and aeration which was one of the major concerns the book covers with our oceans. I'm glad it's not a very efficient mechanical filtration. I feel it's just right for our systems.
 
With my large ats skimmerless setup i really had no nitrates despite heavy feedings. The ats if sized and maintained properly is very efficient at stablizing ph and removing nitrate (though phosphate will need extra help).. the great advantage adding the skimmer gave me was removal or prevention of heavy detritus. If i continue to give skimmerless another shot ill need to figure out a good way of removing detritus (already have high flow and stir sand bed). Some sort of settling tank? The tests done have me convinced skimming does remove a large amount of bacterioplankton

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk
 
I don't touch my detritus and let it build up like mud in my sump. It becomes food and home for many organisms. My skimmer doesn't prevent that from happening at all.
 
If someone does come up with an inexpensive, reliable way to estimate the bacterial count in a reef tank's water column they could have the next reef 'hit' :)

From reading the few articles that deal with this topic (like Ken Feldman's) of interest is not only the mechanical removal of bacteria, but also the intense bacterial predation in the typical reef tank. In order to keep bacteria in higher concentration, it would seem that a simple flow through system with minimal live rock and live sand would be helpful in keeping counts higher (live rock efficiently removes microrganisms primarily via its resident periphyton and live sand via advection into the substrate...which is not so desireable in this case).

Thinking off the top of my head, if the system has reduced flow and is fed continuously with very fine nutrients in suspension to keep the bacteria continuously reproducing in the water column, I would imagine that a 4X (or greater) than normal bacterial concentration would be achievable. Keeping it there could be achieved with regular water changes that are just sufficient to keep the bacteria levels stable (experimentation would be needed to determine the correct water change amount/frequency).

Like Timfish, I don't run skimmers (or any mechanical/chemical filtration) for the same basic reasons and this approach has stood the test of time in many reef tanks (30+ years and three tanks later, in my case). Although it may seem paradoxical, the simplest well-maintained systems tend to be the most robust.
 
photosynthate


Keep in mind we don't have an ocean with the diversity of the food web they can carry. Using the book suggested above they show some study that photosynthate increases DOC which could impact corals with out enough grazers up the food chain. The study showed increased inorganic nutrients did not impact the corals but increased organics did.

A skimmer will not remove inorganics directly but algae like an algae scrubber can. A skimmer will help remove the DOCs. I see the two as a good complement to each other. But as mentioned by others in support for no skimmers and myself skimmers are not that efficient. Which to me is good and leaves plenty for microbes.
 
Last edited:
dingodan87 said:
Doing anything special?? Carbon dosing? Feeding? Supplementing?

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Nothing special. I designed and built my own reactor, basically its a bacteria driven reactor to consume NO3 & PO4. The by product after maturity is bacteria plankton, which happens after 5th week of running. Its a bonus for me as I no longer spot feed my LPS and sun coral except occasional gonio powder to feed my clam and goniopora.
 
djbon said:
Nothing special. I designed and built my own reactor, basically its a bacteria driven reactor to consume NO3 & PO4. The by product after maturity is bacteria plankton, which happens after 5th week of running. Its a bonus for me as I no longer spot feed my LPS and sun coral except occasional gonio powder to feed my clam and goniopora.
Click to expand...
Similar to dymico filter? Im thinking of converting my refugium into one

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk
 
I'm a big fan of having enough food in the water to feed corals without having to spot feed. Especially for sun's and other nps.
 
Naturally occuring food for corals is available round the clock. I just had a 2 days plankton bloom. Wish i have mandarin
 
dingodan87 said:
You underestimate the amount of detritus i dealt with

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Lol if it's piling up like that I suggest more power heads or more strategic placement of the ones you have. If you keep that junk in suspension it will be eatin or removed by other means of filtration. Skimmer efeciently removes it but it also effecoently removes a lot of beneficial things as well. I am slowly coming to the conclusion that maybe I should run my skimmer half as much. Starting to think 24/7 might not be the way to go anymore. But I can't see going skimmerless completely.
 
Joey_bananas420 said:
Lol if it's piling up like that I suggest more power heads or more strategic placement of the ones you have. If you keep that junk in suspension it will be eatin or removed by other means of filtration. Skimmer efeciently removes it but it also effecoently removes a lot of beneficial things as well. I am slowly coming to the conclusion that maybe I should run my skimmer half as much. Starting to think 24/7 might not be the way to go anymore. But I can't see going skimmerless completely.
Click to expand...
Ive messed around with placement alot. the way i have it now is the best i can do but to really get all the dead spots id have to fill my tank with powerheads. I just added a 25g dilution tank. Basically a 25g water storage container that the tank overflows directly to. The input is near the bottom of the resevior and it overflows into my sump. I put a drain with a valve on the bottom. Cone shaped would be ideal but this is what i had to work with. After 1 day i can see tons of detritus settled on the bottom of the resevior. Grab a bucket and open the valve to suck it out. Problem solved. Now planning my diy dymico filter

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk
 
dingodan87 said:
Ive messed around with placement alot. the way i have it now is the best i can do but to really get all the dead spots id have to fill my tank with powerheads. I just added a 25g dilution tank. Basically a 25g water storage container that the tank overflows directly to. The input is near the bottom of the resevior and it overflows into my sump. I put a drain with a valve on the bottom. Cone shaped would be ideal but this is what i had to work with. After 1 day i can see tons of detritus settled on the bottom of the resevior. Grab a bucket and open the valve to suck it out. Problem solved. Now planning my diy dymico filter

Sent from my SM-G903W using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Awesome would love to see some pics of your take on the diy Dymico
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

HumbleFish
  • Sticky
Chemoprophylaxis vs. Observational Quarantine
Replies
1
Views
821
JohnL
JohnL
J
A never ending bacterial bloom. h2o2?
Replies
13
Views
3K
j_mazzy
J
O
Automatic Biomass Scrubber
2
Replies
24
Views
6K
OzIA
O
KingOfAll_Tyrants
Do Aquarium Conditions Inevitably Bring Unnatural Risks?
Replies
16
Views
3K
KingOfAll_Tyrants
KingOfAll_Tyrants
S
Bacteria diversity
Replies
18
Views
3K
Aquarist007
Aquarist007
Back
Top