Time for a term to die---'cooking' rock...should go away...
- Thread starter Sk8r
- Start date
Was there an actual issue recently or are you just looking for things to post about? lol.
I mean, the use of the term "cooked" in this manner isn't even remotely unique to this hobby. It's a common euphemism for any type of process involved in making or transforming something.
I'm much more concerned about the very common suggestion of the LITERAL practice of using huge amounts of ACID in open rubbermaid bins to cure rock.
I mean, the use of the term "cooked" in this manner isn't even remotely unique to this hobby. It's a common euphemism for any type of process involved in making or transforming something.
I'm much more concerned about the very common suggestion of the LITERAL practice of using huge amounts of ACID in open rubbermaid bins to cure rock.
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Old thread I see.
I heard one of the major online vendors recently call it “dark curing” in one of their videos. Maybe that’s the term we’ve been looking for?
Just recently dark cured quite a few pounds of reef saver that had some reddish turf algae on it. 6 months of dark cure and rocks came out really nice. It’s now stacked in a 75 gallon with light getting ready for a new build. Got some hair algae growing but to be expected.
It’s a great way to get rid of some pesty stuff if you have the time and space.
I heard one of the major online vendors recently call it “dark curing” in one of their videos. Maybe that’s the term we’ve been looking for?
Just recently dark cured quite a few pounds of reef saver that had some reddish turf algae on it. 6 months of dark cure and rocks came out really nice. It’s now stacked in a 75 gallon with light getting ready for a new build. Got some hair algae growing but to be expected.
It’s a great way to get rid of some pesty stuff if you have the time and space.
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BeanAnimal
Premium Member
I don't really have a problem with the term 
People are not putting rock on the stove because they read the words "cooking rock" as a literal. They are putting rock on the stove because some idiot decided it was a good idea and some other idiot babbled on about the reef bro-science as to why it is a good idea. They did this even though 20 well informed people told them it was a bad idea and there were likely a 100 page threads on one several forums that are now locked and resulted in several bans.
Five other idiots that didn't get banned started their own forum or reddit or whatever and reposted the reef bro-science, adding their own take and verified results... and the great conspiracy to have them silenced and viola we have a "new method" of doing something in the hobby!
It then gets passed on from person to person and when an informed party tries to explain that, at best it is not a great idea, the idiot dog-pile begins... People get banned, the thread gets locked and the idiots claim victory and start all over again...
So yeah - it's not the term "rock cooking" that is dangerous... it is the simple fact that this hobby (like any hobby) is a mix of brilliant minds, nitwits and every thing in between. According to many threads, I may be one of the nitwits.
People are not putting rock on the stove because they read the words "cooking rock" as a literal. They are putting rock on the stove because some idiot decided it was a good idea and some other idiot babbled on about the reef bro-science as to why it is a good idea. They did this even though 20 well informed people told them it was a bad idea and there were likely a 100 page threads on one several forums that are now locked and resulted in several bans.
Five other idiots that didn't get banned started their own forum or reddit or whatever and reposted the reef bro-science, adding their own take and verified results... and the great conspiracy to have them silenced and viola we have a "new method" of doing something in the hobby!
It then gets passed on from person to person and when an informed party tries to explain that, at best it is not a great idea, the idiot dog-pile begins... People get banned, the thread gets locked and the idiots claim victory and start all over again...
So yeah - it's not the term "rock cooking" that is dangerous... it is the simple fact that this hobby (like any hobby) is a mix of brilliant minds, nitwits and every thing in between. According to many threads, I may be one of the nitwits.
Except people are literally are putting rocks on their stove and cooking them.
Your points about "bro-science" well taken. Decisions shouldn't be made on an individuals assumptions and assertions without verifying facts and science.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
Ohh I am aware of the dangers of Palytoxin (scared of the stuff... makes me sick every time I brush against my Green Grande) - but still don't believe that people are putting them in pots and pans on the stove because they are taking "cooking rocks" as a literal.
I think they are doing it because there are other idiots who advocate it as being a valid way to rid rock of pests.
I do have to ask though - with there really being no more "live rock" pulled from reefs, stored and shipped damp, are people still actually cooking rock? It is my understanding that during my 10 year sleep from paying attention to anything in this hobby - that LR is now only "aquacultered" and shipped in water... no need to "cook" as there is really no die off.
To reiterate Decisions shouldn't be made on an individuals assumptions and assertions without verifying facts and science.
In my expereince, people are quite capable of making stupid decisions without being advised by another individual.
Whether or not other people are advocating cooking rock to get rid of pests "Dark Curing" or "quarantining" are better, more descriptive terms and much less likely to be misinterpreted and if they are misinterpreted the risk of personal injury is significantly less.
And since you are clearly unaware, the individual in the link was cleaning rock from an established system, not wild live rock. Also, maricultured live rock, being cultured in the open ocean will have all the same organisms as wild live rock, is readily available and is shipped wrapped in wet newspaper and there are still indiviuals using the term "cook" to quaratine or "dark cure" it.
Most importantly, very few aquarists have looked into the research done on palytoxin. Besides being an exceptionally deadly toxin it is thermostable so heating it won't denature it like any other toxins. It is not made by palys or zoas but is made by dinoflagellates and is the toxin in "ciguatera" poisoning which kills individuals eating contaminated seafood. It is also found in many other corals besides zoas or palys ans as it is a dinoflagellate algae it has the potential to be on any surface any other marine algae can grow on.
A note of caution for all aquarists, this paper shows organisms exposed to non lethal doses developing an immune response that provides protection to subsequent exposure. It should not be assumed because an aquarist does not have problem handling corals that the zoas and palys or other corals are not producing it. Individuals who have repeated symptomolgy from handling zoas or palys or other corals might be wise in see their physician.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
Don't get me wrong - I always thought the term "cooking rock" was dumb to begin with. I was just highlighting that you usually can't fix stupid with protective language. The people silly enough to take a term like "cooking rock" as a literal without doing any research... well...
Sure, there are still folks need or want to cure rock. The good news is that the days of garages full of Rubbermaid brutes cycling rock with a heater and skimmer for weeks are (for the most part) gone, when it was once the only way.
Palytoxin: I would go further and say that few reef keepers even know what palytoxin is, let alone looking into research about it. I think most reasonable people would refrain from keeping certain paly/zoa if they knew how dangerous it actually was. As far as it being on on other corals or surfaces, sure but I think the danger is more about concentration and likelihood of exposure at high concentration.
Sure, there are still folks need or want to cure rock. The good news is that the days of garages full of Rubbermaid brutes cycling rock with a heater and skimmer for weeks are (for the most part) gone, when it was once the only way.
Palytoxin: I would go further and say that few reef keepers even know what palytoxin is, let alone looking into research about it. I think most reasonable people would refrain from keeping certain paly/zoa if they knew how dangerous it actually was. As far as it being on on other corals or surfaces, sure but I think the danger is more about concentration and likelihood of exposure at high concentration.
Thank you @Timfish and @BeanAnimal for further discussion.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
Tim and several other's here make some very good points regarding safety. It is kind of crazy that we have to even point out that boiling rocks full of organic material on the stove is a bad idea!
One only has to throw a hot (not even super hot) pepper into a boiling pot, or garbage disposer with hot water to understand how quickly bad stuff gets atomized and inhaled. Capsaicin is no joke, palytoxin can be deadly in far smaller concentration.
There was a thread here back in the day about a dog who sadly passed after licking a bucket of paly covered rock pulled from a tank. I hate to see anybody get harmed but have grave concern for the the unaware family, children, friends and pets of the those who don't do their research. Winning a Darwin award should not include bystanders.
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