Worms in the sand

[Elricsfate]

So I read a lot where folks are talking about worms that live in the sand bed. Apparently sand sifting starfish are seeking these out? (I'm still unclear on whether these stars eat detritus or living organisms, or both).

My question is, what kinds of worms are we talking about here? And if I want to purposely introduce them, where can I get some?

I went with dry rock so as to avoid hitchhiker pest organisms. So anything I want in my tank I have to add myself.

 

[mcgyvr]

Tiny bristle like worms,etc...
Microfauna,etc..

Starfish (sand sifting,etc..) can eat both microfauna and detritus,etc....

IPSF sells "packages" of all sorts of critters.. Not worth the cost IMO though..
http://www.ipsf.com/index.html
http://www.ipsf.com/reefworms.html

Stuff will come assuming you are bringing in corals,etc.. and not dipping (but I know.. a no-no around here)

 

[AlSimmons]

Yes, a sand sifting starfish will decimate the micro fauna living in a sand bed. As far as which kind of worms they're feasting on goes, Spaghetti worms, Hair worms, basically any detrivore it comes across is potentially a meal. The links below might help.

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-06/rs/index.php

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-03/rs/

 

[ca1ore]

If you are going to purposefully introduce micro-fauna into your sand bed there are two things you shouldn't do. Don't add a sifting star and don't vacuum the sand bed. Most of the stuff you'd get in a detritovore kit like the one linked above will come naturally into your tank anyhow, so I concur that they're not worth buying. My tank is 3 years old and I have literally thousands of mini-brittles, micro-brittles, asterina, mini-bristle worms, spaghetti worms , etc. etc.

 

[Elricsfate]

If you are going to purposefully introduce micro-fauna into your sand bed there are two things you shouldn't do. Don't add a sifting star and don't vacuum the sand bed. Most of the stuff you'd get in a detritovore kit like the one linked above will come naturally into your tank anyhow, so I concur that they're not worth buying. My tank is 3 years old and I have literally thousands of mini-brittles, micro-brittles, asterina, mini-bristle worms, spaghetti worms , etc. etc.

I guess the point of getting the microfauna was so that I could get the starfish. My wife likes them (and truthfully so do I). So I wanted to make sure the thing had stuff to eat.

As far as things coming naturally into my tank, I'm a bit confused on that one.

We started the tank with dry rock and bagged "live" sand off the shelf. I won't be adding any more rock. If I dip, treat, quarantine, and body cavity search "everything wet" as recommended on these forums...where are the hitchikers going to come from?

 

[ca1ore]

Ah, right, two assumptions on my part ..... both apparently wrong :lol:

If you're going to get a sand sifter, trying to train it to eat frozen is probably going to work better. Since you've taken the 'hermetically sealed' approach, you would have to purposely add diversity.

 

[Elricsfate]

Ah, right, two assumptions on my part ..... both apparently wrong :lol:

If you're going to get a sand sifter, trying to train it to eat frozen is probably going to work better. Since you've taken the 'hermetically sealed' approach, you would have to purposely add diversity.

No worries. This is a learning opportunity for me.

I do not *have* to go hermetically sealed. lol I just keep reading posts from all the gurus advising that as the best course. But I could order a couple pounds of rock from TBS or some such place I guess...

Also, when people say to try to train bottom dwelling creatures (like scooter blennies, starfish) to "eat frozen"... eat frozen what? All the cubes and such float...and then break up...and then get dispersed all over the tank. So how do I stick a frozen food item directly in the face of whatever it is that I am trying to get to eat it?

Pardon the newb questions...I'm a newb.

 

[AlSimmons]

You might want to try some shrimp, scallops, clams etc from the supermarket first. These can easily be cut up into bite size portions and then placed on the substrate for the starfish to eat. Pellets are worth a try too.

 

[ca1ore]

I do not *have* to go hermetically sealed. lol I just keep reading posts from all the gurus advising that as the best course.

It's a lot about personal preference. I always go for live rock because I find the micro diversity particularly interesting, and I think the 'pests' are dramatically overblown. In 30 years reefing, with all tanks started from live rock (maybe some dry rock as the under-sand base), I've only had three problematic hikers: a large mantis, a Bobbitt worm and an octopus. Each was relatively easy to remove. Everything else was either beneficial or benign.

 

[Green Chromis]

No worries. This is a learning opportunity for me.

I do not *have* to go hermetically sealed. lol I just keep reading posts from all the gurus advising that as the best course. But I could order a couple pounds of rock from TBS or some such place I guess...

Also, when people say to try to train bottom dwelling creatures (like scooter blennies, starfish) to "eat frozen"... eat frozen what? All the cubes and such float...and then break up...and then get dispersed all over the tank. So how do I stick a frozen food item directly in the face of whatever it is that I am trying to get to eat it?

Pardon the newb questions...I'm a newb.

:fish1: Hi Elricsfate, I highly doubt any of the real experts on this site would recommend starting a system with all dead sand and rock, but maybe a few would, just to try something different . Starting a system with a dead biological filtration system can be done, but it takes a long, long time for the system to become established, and you will still need some type of high quality live rock to seed the system. The cost of the setup is a lot cheaper in the short term, but over the long term success of your system, the cost will balance out. Their is so much more to live rock, then just the bacteria, all the micro, and macro fauna and flora that comes with a very high quality live rock, cannot be duplicated unless you use a high quality live rock, like TBS to seed your rock and sand. On the frozen foods, thaw the food in a small container using your tank water and pour the food thru a very fine mesh net, then add to your system, if target feeding use a turkey baster, or pipette to feed the targeted specimen. :fish1: