Go Big OR Go Home! Construction of a 1000 gallon System!!

[paulfromero]

Hi all,

I think the concept of two people pulling on a tow line is similar to these two pumps. One adds to the 'push' of the other.

Paul

 

[bstone]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6779084#post6779084 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by polywise
bstone,
I run two dolphin series pumps on 18' of head. They are run in parralel, for the first 8 feet up to the ceiling, and then both hook up to 3" piping for the rest of the 75' trip to the tank.

imo / experience: you are just "super charging" your second pump-- giving it more available water than it could actually suck from your sump. You are not dealing with a head preasure situation and do not need that kind of configuration.

I would suggest that you realy think about your set up. You will be amazed at the actual volume outcome.

Did you see the graph above.

Listen peole this is simple... I have more then 25 feet of head pressure, so one pump will hardly give me flow (refer to graph and curve labled singe pump). Now run you finger across the the 25 foot mark and you will see that one pump will not function at 25 feet of head preassure; or at a very low flow! Now, when you add the next pump in series (now refer to the curve labeled 2 pumps in series). At 25 feet of head pressure my flow is now 4300 gph. If I pump the water in parrallel I "WILL NOT" have any flow. You can add 4 pumps in parrallel, but if you have more then 25 feet of head pressure you will not get any flow at all..

 

[ReefWaters]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6778262#post6778262 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bstone
That is for pumps in parrellel. Mine are in series. Anyway..
Look at it this way, if my head preasure was greater then 25 then I might get a little bite of flow with one pump on, but when I turn on the second pump my flow jumps to 4200 GPH.

The graph is saying that one pump at 25 feet of pressure would not pump anything at all (0 gph). Two pumps in parallel would not pump anything at 25 feet of pressure either. Two pumps in series would pump approximately 4600 gph at 25 feet of pressure.

 

[bstone]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6779345#post6779345 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ReefWaters
The graph is saying that one pump at 25 feet of pressure would not pump anything at all (0 gph). Two pumps in parallel would not pump anything at 25 feet of pressure either. Two pumps in series would pump approximately 4600 gph at 25 feet of pressure.

Thank You! I'm glad I'm not the only one who can see this now!!

 

[polywise]

Did you see the graph above.
Listen peole this is simple... I have more then 25 feet of head pressure, so one pump will hardly give me flow (refer to graph and curve labled singe pump). Now run you finger across the the 25 foot mark and you will see that one pump will not function at 25 feet of head preassure;

bstone
Am I missing something ?
is the top of your tank 25' above the sump floor?, or are you adding up 25 feet of linear piping that goes to your tank?

 

[AcroSteve]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6779341#post6779341 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bstone
Did you see the graph above.

Listen peole this is simple... I have more then 25 feet of head pressure,

No need to get testy. That's all you had to say(9 or 10 posts ago). From the looks of your setup, I would guess that not many would speculate the head was anywhere near that high. Thus the questions.

 

[bstone]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6779535#post6779535 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by polywise
Did you see the graph above.
Listen peole this is simple... I have more then 25 feet of head pressure, so one pump will hardly give me flow (refer to graph and curve labled singe pump). Now run you finger across the the 25 foot mark and you will see that one pump will not function at 25 feet of head preassure;

bstone
Am I missing something ?
is the top of your tank 25' above the sump floor?, or are you adding up 25 feet of linear piping that goes to your tank?

According to Reef Central Head Loss Calc. I have about 23.34 foot head loss due to number of elbows, check valves, pipe exits, unions, and so on. Even if my head loss was at 15 feet, I would still get the max flow with the pumps in series, which is around 4800 gph.

Look at it this way.

Pump as a single = max head is 24 feet

2 Pumps inseries = max head is 48 feet - if yout head loss is anything less then 24 feet then you will get the max flow of 4800 gph. Any higher and then the flow drops off.

So lets say you have head loss at 15 feet, but you want the max flow of 4800 gph, then you add another pump in series and then your max head rate for the pump doubles (refer to graph) and now your flow maxes at 4800 gph.

But, if you have more then 24 feeet of head presure you will not max your flow, your flow will now decrease as you go higher in head loss over 24 feet.

 

[bstone]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6779688#post6779688 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by AcroSteve
No need to get testy. That's all you had to say(9 or 10 posts ago). From the looks of your setup, I would guess that not many would speculate the head was anywhere near that high. Thus the questions.

Sorry, some people just like to state facts that are not based off of data. That is why I posted the graph and was tring to explain. Didn't mean to get testy. If people would take a second to review the graph instead of saying I am wrong, then I guess I would not of gottin testy. Sorry about that!

 

[AcroSteve]

No problem, we are all just thinking outloud.

Heck of a setup you have there.

When do you figure you will get the rockwork done?

 

[polywise]

bstone,
no problem over here, I did not feel that you were getting upset with me. I was only commenting with some prior experiences

I didn't think about all of your fittings, check and ball valves. I am supprised that they come so much into play with your flow....

 

[jnarowe]

Don't forget that Sea-Swirls will take a bite out of the gph too.

 

[bstone]

Well, I ordered 10 more 2" bulkheads. My plan is to have 4 2" PVC lines between sump 1 and sump 2, and also 4 2" lines between sump 2 and sump 3. I hope this will be enough to handle the flow between each of the sumps when the skimmers, and chiller pump are not on.

Thanks ReefWaters, AcroSteve, and jnarowe for the recommendation on adding more lines between sumps.

 

[jnarowe]

That's a lot of BHs!!! What about 3" ones?

 

[bstone]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6796374#post6796374 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jnarowe
That's a lot of BHs!!! What about 3" ones?

I thought about that, too much of a pain to install. Plus, I am sure I can find 3" bulkheads, I just didn't look very hard. I think that 4 2" lines will work...

 

[jnarowe]

not much pain to install, just a bigger hole saw. If you decide on using them, PM me and I'll point you to the best deal I found. They are not cheap, but two 3" would provide a lot of flow.

So what made you decide to increase the flow? Experimentation??

 

[bstone]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6796557#post6796557 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jnarowe
not much pain to install, just a bigger hole saw. If you decide on using them, PM me and I'll point you to the best deal I found. They are not cheap, but two 3" would provide a lot of flow.

So what made you decide to increase the flow? Experimentation??

I just wanted to make sure that the flow from sump to sump will not overflow if the skimmer and chiller pumps are off. That way the natual gravity flow of water from sump to sump would be enough if the equipment pumps are off for maintanance or what ever.

 

[bstone]

I did find 3" bulkheads from the place I get most of my plumbing supplies, they were $75.95 each. OUCH!

 

[jnarowe]

got mine for $50 each.

 

[asnatlas]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6796686#post6796686 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bstone
I did find 3" bulkheads from the place I get most of my plumbing supplies, they were $75.95 each. OUCH!

If you don't mind me asking, where did you get your 2" from and how much ?? If I rem right I paid 15.xx for 2" sched 80 BH from Savko...

 

[Julio]

wow, i paid about $10 for a 2 inch bulk head. $80 they have to be insane.