Poo? Really. POO?! Where did this theory start? I'm calling Shenanigans!

[allsps40]

I am going to disagree with the sps dont eat fish poo. Well I disagree partly. One of the things I did to improve my sps color was added 2 more fish to make more waste. While I agree that corals do not eat fish poo directly it is needed to sustain them. Fish poo feeds the filter feeders, pods, plankton ect as they feed and reproduce this feeds the corals. Fish poo also feeds bacteria which we now know sps feed off of and the bacteria makes no3 which also is known to improve sps color if kept low (around 3-5ppm). So less fish=less fish poo= less plankton, pods, bacteria ect= less food for corals. JMO. There are other ways of feeding corals in a fish less reef like Phytoplankton and Zooplankton and other coral foods. I feel that a combo of feeding and fish makes the best variety.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

I am going to disagree with the sps dont eat fish poo. Well I disagree partly. One of the things I did to improve my sps color was added 2 more fish to make more waste. While I agree that corals do not eat fish poo directly it is needed to sustain them. Fish poo feeds the filter feeders, pods, plankton ect as they feed and reproduce this feeds the corals. Fish poo also feeds bacteria which we now know sps feed off of and the bacteria makes no3 which also is known to improve sps color if kept low (around 3-5ppm). So less fish=less fish poo= less plankton, pods, bacteria ect= less food for corals. JMO. There are other ways of feeding corals in a fish less reef like Phytoplankton and Zooplankton and other coral foods. I feel that a combo of feeding and fish makes the best variety.

how predictable.
Zero PO4 and zero bacteria are clearly to be avoided in reef aquaria.

 

[allsps40]

how predictable.
Zero PO4 and zero bacteria are clearly to be avoided in reef aquaria.

PO4 is detrimental to sps growth, keeps the coral from being able to build its calcium skeleton. So yes low to 0 PO4 is necessary for keeping sps successfully. As for bacteria, if there was no bacteria in our reef tanks then the waste could not be converted in to nitrites and nitrates and then removed. Ammonia would build up very quickly without bacteria, killing all the corals and fish. There are certain bacterias that we dont want in our tanks. However a sterile tank is neither beneficial or desirable in any aquarium. I never said that you wanted 0 bacteria and yes you do want to keep PO4 as close to zero as possible while maintaining a sufficient food source for the corals and fish. Fish poo feeds bacteria feeds corals.

 

[LifeAquatic]

Sps

Sps

Is it wrong to think that some of the Poo is used as food and the rest is just skimmed out before it breaks down into waste? It would be the same result as using marketed SPS food. Whatever is not consumed will just get skimmed out anyway.

 

[pimp2daizzo]

im pretty sure the corals do feed on it...i just want to know how much protien is left in the food when the corals eat it...

 

[MammothReefer]

Just because something can consume something doesn't mean it's beneficial to them.

 

[SPSEMPIRE]

I wonder what Nitrogen has to do with this topic and how it affects the photosynthetic respiration rate...

 

[pimp2daizzo]

Just because something can consume something doesn't mean it's beneficial to them.

thats what i was getting at...i can see a big change in the corals when i feed coral food

 

[Amphiprion]

When looking at the needs of corals, there are instances where the inclusion of fish can help some, but probably not as much as purposeful additions of food. N or P limited corals (starving corals in this context) will gladly take dissolved N and P that results from fish waste and its associated flora/fauna and can switch preferences based on "food" availability to some extent. Bacterioplankton, etc. that naturally comes from fish waste will also be consumed to some degree or another, too. So, in that context it can still very well be beneficial, especially when few people know if they are actually feeding "enough." Saying that fish fecal matter is completely non-beneficial or completely beneficial is really self-deceiving and is totally dependent upon the individual system and corals within it. I think many are, quite surprisingly, missing that point altogether.

As far as personal opinion goes, not having fish with corals is just, well, completely unnatural. Maximizing the variety of foods sources, both in terms of prey capture and particulate capture, is what I would personally work toward and is more similar to what corals would get in the wild. The inclusion of fish, along with good planktonic-type foods seems like the better approach in achieving that. I think dealing with associated increases in nutrient levels from both foods and fish waste is a different subject from whether or not things can actually be utilized. On that subject, if fish feces has lots of phosphate, what does food, in general, have in it ? /semi rant and/or rambling. I can has cold meds.

 

[allsps40]

^ You got it spot on. Corals foods, bacterial plankton and fish waste all feed corals to a point and creates the best variety of food sources in a closed reef tank.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

Corals foods, bacterial plankton and fish waste are off topic

Corals foods, bacterial plankton and fish waste are off topic

I think many are, quite surprisingly, missing that point altogether.

I think so, too.

Poo is poo.
Taken literally, SPS don't eat fish poo. That's what this thread is about.

Feed corals appropriate foods, get rid of any and all the poo in your reef aquarium you can and your (clean environment) SPS corals will be better off for it.

OR, if you think it's good... feed your reef aquarium fish poo.

Scrape some skimmate out of your skimmer collection cup and feed it to your aquarium. Rinse the filter sock out in the aquarium.

There's no doubt that some fish waste products can benefit them but corals don't color up because of fish turds.

For coloring up SPS corals remove fish poo ASAP

 

[Amphiprion]

There's no doubt that some fish waste products can benefit them but corals don't color up because of fish turds.

Ah, I misunderstood you before. I agree with the above

 

[dixiedog]

Scrape some skimmate out of your skimmer collection cup and feed it to your aquarium. Rinse the filter sock out in the aquarium.

Can I use that for my sig line?? LOL :lolspin:

 

[Acronic]

I like the theory that the poop feeds the micro fauna and smaller organisms which in turn feed the SPS.

The best feeding response Ive ever witnessed in any of my tanks was when my trochus snails were spawning. Something about the sperm and eggs of the snails made the corals go crazy.

Like in this acro, I never knew the polyps could inflate this much!

 

[eyeluvcoral]

Nutrients are great for plant growth and corals are part algae. Think of it like fertilizer for your zoanthelle. I think low nutrient levels are the ticket with corals in general though.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

Can I use that for my sig line?? LOL :lolspin:

go for it. Here's another one you might consider:

Fish turds make great algae fertilizer.

 

[dixiedog]

You da man, Gary. I love this thread, it's kind of an "emperor has no clothes" thing.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

thanks.

I realize that I'm taking the term "poo" literally but that's what this thread is all about- specific information.

Why?

Because uninformed reefkeepers reading internet threads take things literally. Internet reefkeepers keep posting they feed their SPS fish poo. Poo is solid waste matter. SPS don't eat it.

Let's be specific, folks!

You want to make growing/coloring up Acropora more difficult?
Load your reef aquarium up with big fish that poop a lot.

Better yet, load up your reef aquarium with big fish that poop a lot and have a poor circulation/filtration system.

Of course, such a system might be PERFECT for growing Xenia.
But that's not what this thread is all about, is it?

Lots not go off on tangents.

 

[Big E]

Taken literally, SPS don't eat fish poo. That's what this thread is about.

Feed corals appropriate foods, get rid of any and all the poo in your reef aquarium you can and your (clean environment) SPS corals will be better off for it.

Yes, corals don't literally eat pooh, but you can't side step the fact they need an amount of phosphate & nitrate to survive which the fish waste provides once broken down as others have mentioned. This waste is just as viable a souce of N & P as the so called coral foods. The end result is the same.......... N&P for the corals to survive.

My disagreement is that the coral foods that are commercially available aren't feeding SPS corals, they are polluting the water just a fish waste does to add N&P to the water.

We've become so efficient at reducing nutrients that SPS corals now starve as a result & coral "foods" have become popular. Some peiople prefer to add more fish to serve the same end result.

 

[ousnakebyte]

My disagreement is that the coral foods that are commercially available aren't feeding SPS corals, they are polluting the water just a fish waste does to add N&P to the water.

We've become so efficient at reducing nutrients that SPS corals now starve as a result & coral "foods" have become popular. Some peiople prefer to add more fish to serve the same end result.

Live artemia nauplii are readily accepted by corals - even the "sps" corals.

Reposting this for convenience:

Here is a paper from 2008 that discusses the benefits of feeding newly settled corals:

Petersen, D., Wietheger, A., Laterveer, M. [2008] Influence of different food sources on the initial development of sexual recruits of reefbuilding corals in aquaculture. Aquaculture 277:174-178.

In summary, feeding good old-fashioned newly-hatch brine shrimp to your corals is beneficial - you are not wasting your money there.

The corals used in the study were Acropora tenuis and Favia fragum. To my knowledge, Dirk did not have any fish in these systems, only snails and hermit crabs for grazing. But, I need to reread the paper to double check my accuracy there.

I have also witnessed "sps" corals feeding on frozen rotifers.

Cheers
Mike