Reefer 425xl vs. 120 Standard

[Hentz]

Hey guys, I'm in the process of buying a house in the next couple of months.
That being said, I'll be upgrading with the house and would love personal suggestions with experiences.

I downgraded from my Crystal Dynamics 56 Gallon (36x18x20) to a Red Sea Reefer 170 due to space issues. I absolutely love the tank and the build quality of the Reefer, which is why I'm considering the 425xl. But that being said, I feel a bit cramped in the Reefer 170 and seeing all of your gorgeous builds makes me excited to start planning a goal-setup for when I move.

I plan on doing quite a slow upgrade and taking my time with the build. So I'm in the very beginning stages of planning and am in no rush to jump into things!

I'm not looking to "build my ultimate dream setup". Though I am looking to spend the best bang for your buck. I could find most equipment used which I'm never opposed too either.

I'm very torn on the Red Sea Reefer 425xl and a Standard 120 (4'x2'x2').
The only difference between the two is I could get the 120 for a bit less plus I'd be able to do a Synergy overflow allowing me to utilize the full dimensions. However, going rimless on the 120 would be about the same as the Reefer 425xl.

The tank would be SPS Dominant and running the ZEOvit method as I am now.

Equipment I will use that I currently have:
- Lighting: 1 Hydra 26HD (Unless switching to ATI)
- Controller: Apex Jr. w/ EB4+EB8 w/ PM1 + pH Probe + Temp. Probe
- ZEOvit Reactor: Vertex Rx-Z 1.5l Reactor
- Flow: Maxspect Gyre 130 (Maybe just using as xtra flow)

Equipment I'd be considering and need some suggestions on:
- Lighting: 3 Hydra 26HD's vs. ATI 6/8x54w SunPower
- Flow: 2x Ecotech Marine MP40QD vs. 2x Maxspect Gyre 250
- Return: Reef Octopus VarioS-6 (1720) vs. Ecotech Marine Vectra M1
- Skimmer: Vertex Omega 150 vs. Reef Octopus Classic 150SSS 6"
If going with 120:
- Sump: Trigger Emerald 34 vs. Bashsea 36x15x16" Tuxedo

Please don't be afraid to recommend other equipment that is not listed!

 

[JUNBUG361]

If your talking about the Reefer 425 xl deluxe with 2 hydra 26 hd led
2 ecotech mp40
Ecotech m1 return pump
Reef octopus, simplicity, Nyos quantum, bubble Magnus, aquamaxx??
2 media reactors
Just my opinion

 

[Ron Reefman]

I was seriously looking at a Red Sea Reefer system when I run into a CADlight Artisan 125. It cost about 30% less and IMHO pretty much the same build quality as the RS Reefer. And I really like the extra sump room in the stand. You can see my build thread if you want more info. The link address is in my signature.

 

[Hentz]

I was seriously looking at a Red Sea Reefer system when I run into a CADlight Artisan 125. It cost about 30% less and IMHO pretty much the same build quality as the RS Reefer. And I really like the extra sump room in the stand. You can see my build thread if you want more info. The link address is in my signature.

Oh I follow your build thread actually!
I considered the CAD125, thanks to you. Though I also read multiple reports about their stands being issues. Have you had any of those issues?

 

[solitude127]

Tough call there. If you don't mind doing plumbing and other tasks in setting up a tank, I'd go with the custom 120. But for a plug and play system, you can't beat the Red Sea Reefer.

 

[ktownhero]

I was planning a standard 120 for months and then came across the 425XL on sale. Absolutely thrilled that I made the choice to go with the 425XL. It's better than I ever imagined my own build to be. Top notch quality all around and it's nice to just be able to focus on equipment instead of the entire infrastructure.

Tough call there. If you don't mind doing plumbing and other tasks in setting up a tank, I'd go with the custom 120. But for a plug and play system, you can't beat the Red Sea Reefer.

The Reefer series is not "plug and play" (The MAX series is) -- they only provide the tank, overflow and sump. You still need to get all of the equipment that plugs in. They really are the best of both worlds IMO. You won't get a better quality tank/stand/sump at the price they sell these things for, especially if you get one on sale.

 

[ktownhero]

To follow up to my last post, I'll tell you how my 425XL is set up:

Kessil AP700
2x Vortech MP40
2x Eheim Jager 200w heater
Eheim 1262 return pump
Vertex Omega 150 skimmer
Two Little Fishies Phosban 150 (just for carbon)
60lbs of Pukani (~40lbs in display, ~20lbs in the fuge section of my sump)

I also purchased the baffle kit from Reef Dreams that splits the main sump area into a fuge and skimmer chamber. Love it.

What would I change if I were doing it again? Well, I think the Vertex 150 is a bit big for this tank. I would choose a skimmer with a smaller footprint just to make life easier maintenance-wise. I also would have preferred a skimmer that could handle the 10.6" of depth of the sump so I wouldn't have had to build a 3" stand that collects detritus underneath. The Kessil AP700 does an incredible job covering the whole tank, though I am not sure I'd pay full price for it ($900). I am probably going to add 2 T5 tubes down the line just to even out the light and balance out the shimmer. If money were no object and I was doing this again, I'd just get an ATi Powermodule and call it a day. If budget was a concern I'd just go with the ReefBreeder Photon v2.

Also to note: the MP40s are insanely powerful. It depends on scape of course, but with my more open scape even a single MP40 at 40% creates flow EVERYWHERE in the tank. I got two because the flow modes work much better that way. But you could probably get away with MP10s if you wanted. One thing that Red Sea doesn't advertise is that the side panels are 3/8" glass so MP10s can work there. It's nice having the MP40s though just because there's always room to grow. As my scape fills out, I may find I need the extra power.

 

[moondoggy4]

Are you looking at the SCA aquariums?

 

[Hentz]

To follow up to my last post, I'll tell you how my 425XL is set up:

Kessil AP700
2x Vortech MP40
2x Eheim Jager 200w heater
Eheim 1262 return pump
Vertex Omega 150 skimmer
Two Little Fishies Phosban 150 (just for carbon)
60lbs of Pukani (~40lbs in display, ~20lbs in the fuge section of my sump)

I also purchased the baffle kit from Reef Dreams that splits the main sump area into a fuge and skimmer chamber. Love it.

What would I change if I were doing it again? Well, I think the Vertex 150 is a bit big for this tank. I would choose a skimmer with a smaller footprint just to make life easier maintenance-wise. I also would have preferred a skimmer that could handle the 10.6" of depth of the sump so I wouldn't have had to build a 3" stand that collects detritus underneath. The Kessil AP700 does an incredible job covering the whole tank, though I am not sure I'd pay full price for it ($900). I am probably going to add 2 T5 tubes down the line just to even out the light and balance out the shimmer. If money were no object and I was doing this again, I'd just get an ATi Powermodule and call it a day. If budget was a concern I'd just go with the ReefBreeder Photon v2.

Also to note: the MP40s are insanely powerful. It depends on scape of course, but with my more open scape even a single MP40 at 40% creates flow EVERYWHERE in the tank. I got two because the flow modes work much better that way. But you could probably get away with MP10s if you wanted. One thing that Red Sea doesn't advertise is that the side panels are 3/8" glass so MP10s can work there. It's nice having the MP40s though just because there's always room to grow. As my scape fills out, I may find I need the extra power.

I've went over your thread quite a few times actually. I really love the 22" height of the 425xl. Not that the 24" would be bad, but I do love shallowish tanks.

Yes I noticed you had a little stand for your Skimmer. I've noticed actually quite a few people do in the reefer's. My poor Curve 5 is just not skimming like it should, water level is too low in the Sump of the Reefer 170 I think.

I wouldn't do a Kessil, nothing against them. I'd either continue to use Hydra 26HD's but add 2 more or just go back to full T5. Frankly, it wouldn't be much of a price difference unless I get a steal on used ones.

I agree, one MP40 would be plenty a period of time. Though I ran 2 on my 56 Gallon SPS tank and it was perfect. However, the QD's are more powerful. That being said, if I did go with MP's, I would go with two indefinitely. While it might be a temporary over-kill, it would allow me to produce the required chaotic flow for when the colonies fill in.

My aquascape would be a pretty open one especially considering the rock I have in my tank now is a "cliff" style scape.

Btw, your scape is great man. It has such character to it. Can't wait to see it stocked with corals man.

 

[Hentz]

Are you looking at the SCA aquariums?

Of course. I've considered their 120. It's attractive because it comes with everything needed. I've even thought about sending Steve an email asking about a custom size.

They're pretty great bang for your buck and from what I hear, they offer amazing customer service. Along with Red Sea.

 

[Ron Reefman]

Hentz, I read some bad reviews about CADlight systems also. But my experience has been quite good. The only issue I had was they didn't pack the box of plumbing in with everything else. It slowed down my build while a waited 5 days to get it. Then I found that it's all metric and I wouldn't even consider using it, so I did all my own with pvc and hose from Lowes.

At 6 months in everything still looks brand new. The finish on the stand has been wet from the odd spill and it still shines like the day I got it. Maybe I'm the only satisfied CADlight customer out there?

Good luck whatever you choose.

 

[soulpatch]

Of course. I've considered their 120. It's attractive because it comes with everything needed. I've even thought about sending Steve an email asking about a custom size.

They're pretty great bang for your buck and from what I hear, they offer amazing customer service. Along with Red Sea.

They have a 150 predrilled for the Synergy overflow at this point so for them to do the same for a 120 would be easy enough. They also now do rimless (though not on their website) so you could likely get the 120 rimless drilled for the overflow for less then you think.

I would not do their sumps though and would get something like a trigger or if you want to go all out a geo/synergy/bao sump.

 

[Hentz]

They have a 150 predrilled for the Synergy overflow at this point so for them to do the same for a 120 would be easy enough. They also now do rimless (though not on their website) so you could likely get the 120 rimless drilled for the overflow for less then you think.

I would not do their sumps though and would get something like a trigger or if you want to go all out a geo/synergy/bao sump.

Oh wow, I was not aware of that.

To be cost effective, I do have a stand that my frag tank sits on which is 48"L x 24"W X 32"-34"H (not sure on height). I could always sell the frag tank setup and keep the stand and only spend a couple hundred on the 120 itself.

I agree with their sumps, I probably wouldn't consider using one.

How are the return pumps they come with? Did you use that or use something different?

 

[soulpatch]

I do not use any of their equipment and many who get them use the retrun pumps for mixing stations as they are loud. I personally have a Fluval SP6 on my 150.

 

[Hentz]

I do not use any of their equipment and many who get them use the retrun pumps for mixing stations as they are loud. I personally have a Fluval SP6 on my 150.

Ah okay.
Just emailed them asking for two quotes. One for a standard 120 rimless with the back drilled for the synergy shadow overflow, and the other for a 48x30x22 with rimless and drilled for synergy shadow overflow. Interested in hearing how much they'd like.

 

[soulpatch]

If you need MPs or such ask them about those as well as they sell some equipment for NICE prices......

 

[Hentz]

Got my quote back from Steve. Price for 120 gallon 48x24x24 15mm rimless and drilled for synergy overflow is $1350 with shipping included.

My LFS has a Visio for $449. Rimmed and standard glass, but drilled on the back with a Eshopps Eclipse overflow.

At that price point, I'd only need a sump and a return pump. Would save a lot of money since I already have the stand if I went with the Visio.

Not sure, I have a ways to go, I think, for a new tank. So I do have time to save and build up equipment slowly over the next couple of months.

 

[moondoggy4]

Have you checked into Will Call? What was the price with the 30" wide tank?

 

[Hentz]

Steve Chow: "Price for 48x30x22" 15mm rimless and drilled for synergy overflow is $1495 with shipping included."

 

[ReefCowboy]

Hentz

I got the SC 15mm predrilled for the synergy, and quality is right there with the Reefer. I was set on the red sea tank also, but the tower overflow gets on my nerves. I'm not too crazy about the depth of the 425XL either...30" deep is awesome for aquascaping. 22" tall is ideal IMO also.