Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

[budster.stig1]

Bean: I have been using this design in planning my next system. I will build a twin 150's in wall system with about 110g sump, fuge, return. I am planning about 900g flow to each DT and about 300g flow to the fuge. I am going to order my tanks soon and would like your opinion on this configuration. I will have a vertical interior overflow 16" wide with the three holes drilled in the back glass. Holes will be 6" on center from top of tank and will be 1" in dia.. I will use 1" pvc for drain system and 3/4" for return water, that hole will be in the back wall on the opposite end of the tank from the overflow. I will order my tanks as soon as I fell good about this design working well, your comments will be greatly appreciated................Stig.

 

[reefermad619]

1.5" for open channel is what I would do. The bigger the size on the open channel, the less likely it will be to make noise.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Fired it up today. Works perfect man, just awesome. Now if only the pump housing didn't have a leak in it, the entire system would be great.

 

[darb85]

How important is it that the drains are straight? I plan on having a short 45 degree slope to the sump, it will have two 45s to make it happen.

Thanks

Brad

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

On the one I just fired up the other day, I had a 2' drop to a 45 elbow, then about 2' of spa flex that went into a 90, then straight thru the valve to the sump. Purged in about 5 seconds after pump startup. IIRC the important thing is the placement of the valve, you want it as close to the sump end as possible. Also a good valve really helps. I got a Cepex dual-union valve and with that smooth ball and big handle you can fine tune that sucker easily.

edit: see pic of what I'm talking about in post 4025

 

[Neoferdina]

I was wondering if anyone could offer me advice on my problem:

I want to make an external overflow box that is connected to the bean animal plumbing methodology. Some of you guys have done this by drilling holes in the back panel of the tank, letting the water pass through the holes to the external overflow, and then down the drain. An easy solution, yes, but there is no surface skimming in this case.

What I would like to do is remove an eighth of an inch of glass from the back panel of my aquarium (rimless), have water overflow that coast to coast style into the external box, and then down the drain. If one were to google "glass reef overflow" the first link that might appear would describe the situation exactly.

So the question is, how can I remove a thin strip of glass from the back panel of my aquarium? Having cut glass before I'm fairly certain that trying to score and snap such a thin piece would end in disaster. Can I grind it down with a hand held sander and copious amounts of water? What kind of paper would I need? How might I keep the overflow level?

Thanks for any advice!

That's what I did with my recent build. I recommend a 1" notch. The thickness of the water layer over a 12" overflow at 500 gph is about .65". Plus you want some room for splashing. I did a 1.25" notch.

You can do it with a drench and diamond bit but I recommend gettig anglass shop to do it. The $$ is worth it. Alternatively, you could cut the whole back glass 1" shorter and build the box off of that but it's not at pretty looking.

 

[jason2459]

Those who implement the design un this manner use a slim internal weir

It would be somewhat pointless to build an external box with no internal weir.

Exactly what I just got implemented. ~2.8" hole drilled in the middle top of the tank with a narrow internal weir covering the hole then the external overflow in the back with the three 1.5" drain bulk heads.

BTW, also really wanted to thank you very much for sharing your design and setup! I love it and absolutely silent in the basement where I found out it maters most because the wife's crafts room is right next to the fish room.

With out your site I would probably just have a single drain and with out this thread I wouldn't have known to put the valves right before the sump in the basement and that worked perfectly. Zero bubbles and zero noise down there from the drains.

:beer:

 

[joegoersch]

Questions about building internal coast to coast

Questions about building internal coast to coast

I' m upgrading from a 29 gallon tank to a 120 (48 long, x 24 x 24) and will be building it with a beananimal style overflow.

I have a few quesions and would appreciate input from anyone who has made an internal coast-to-coast overflow.

1) I've been debating between having the overflow truly coast-to-coast (i.e. from one side to the other) versus leaving space on one side (or on both sides) so that the returns can come in through a bulkhead high up on the tank. Any thoughts ? Will one be more stable than the other ? Is there any chance of the glass getting pulled off the tank by the torque ? I realize there will be little force on the overflow when the tank is full, but if at any time during maintenance the water level falls, there will be some water in the overflow and the weight of the glass will tend to torque the overflow, pulling the overflow glass away from the back wall. Is this an issue ?

Will there be any problems with stability if I don't silicone the overflow to the sides of the tank ?

2) I've read some people recommend 1/4 inch glass but this seems like overkill. Since the overflow will hold only a small amount of water (if the overflow is 48 inches long x 4 inches thick x 6 inches high--thats only 5 gallons) and since even 20 gallon tanks aren't made of 1/4 inch glass, wouldn't 1/8 inch glass be more than enough ? Would it be easier to silicone 1/8th or 1/4 inch glass ?

3) I have siliconed glass for a refugium. It worked o.k., but, man, did it look messy. Anyone know of a thread that explains how to do it well ?

Thanks !


:bounce2:

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

1) the water in the overflow should never be full, because of the drains. Maybe half full. And no probably not enough torque. Have you ever tried to pull apart 2 pieces of glass siliconed to each other by pulling in the direction of the torque you describe? Good luck! I think you'll be ok as long as the silicone job is done right.

2) Overkill is better than underkill. 1/4" glass I would think has more surface area for the silicone to bond to. Accounts for imperfect bonds made by DIY. Plus if you bump it with a rock during maintenance, 1/4" will probably resist breaking better than 1/8".

3) I'll let someone else go into detail, but use of blue painter's tape to create nice lines and smoothing out the silicone corner bead with your finger dipped in very hot water are a couple things I read about. I tried to re-seal a 37g this way, turned out OK but I found a few bubbles and did it over, found a few more, gave up.

 

[joegoersch]

Thanks! I guess a tiny leak in the overflow is no big deal.

What about the idea of the coast-to-coast occupying only, say, the middle 2/3 of the back wall with returns on either side of it?

 

[Chappy]

Bean, I have read about 100 pages of this thread...phew. I"m about to start a roughly 300 gallon peninsula and want to incorporate your concept.

If you were going to do a peninsula, would you rather have an external overflow box, or set it up like you have on your tank now? I have enough room for either, but don't know an advantage of the external other than more room in the tank.

I'm also going to be using a Dart and the sump is under the tank, so about 5 feet under. Would you still go with 1.5 inch bulkhead, down to one inch pipe?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

That's what I did. External box does allow for everything to be above the bulkhead = no solvent joints. and no need for the screw on end caps, etc. Just TFE paste things together, or just friction fit which works fine.

 

[jason2459]

That's what I did. External box does allow for everything to be above the bulkhead = no solvent joints. and no need for the screw on end caps, etc. Just TFE paste things together, or just friction fit which works fine.

Yep, same here. Everything is dry fitted and worked great testing a failure.

 

[Chappy]

That's what I did. External box does allow for everything to be above the bulkhead = no solvent joints. and no need for the screw on end caps, etc. Just TFE paste things together, or just friction fit which works fine.

Could you explain that a little more. Or take a pic of your setup?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Look at post #4025

 

[jamesamantha]

So I couldn't quite tell from all my reading of this thread what the prescription is for lower flow pumps. I plan to push 450 GPH through a 24" C2C and I am using 1" bulkheads. I am pretty confused on the path to take.

If I understand this system I can drastically restrict the siphon valve and push however much water I want into the open channel. I am thinking I might want 100 GPH going into the open channel which will feed my fuge.

So this would leave 350 GPH running through the siphon line.

Would I be better off with the siphon line being 1" all the way. Would this make it easier to keep the siphon at a lower flow rate? Also would I want the valve at the end of the pipe in the sump itself?

Thanks to all the posters and for any advice!

James

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

That's pretty low flow through the siphon, so it's going to take a while to fully purge I would think, but it should work as long as you put the valve as close to the sump as possible, so yes you have the right idea. As far as the open channel, if you want to push more than just a trickle through it, that should be fine. But keep in mind that the purpose of that pipe is to take over if the siphon gets clogged, and with a valve closed enough to compensate for a low flow system, you have a greater chance of that pipe clogging, which means all your flow would then switch over to the open channel and you will end up with a ton of flow in your fuge, which could create a problem. Might be better to tee off the siphon line, others have done that, I'm not sure how difficult it is so read up.

 

[Chappy]

Floyd, did you use the 1.5 inch pipes all the way? Also, do you only have one ball valve? And one more thing, do you have a good pic of your sump, I'm about to build mine and was just wondering how you did yours since we are using the same basic system.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2061389

And yes 1.5 for all 3 pipes. Don't reduce down, IIRC you may have a problem getting the upper pipe to purge all the air. Correct me if I am wrong anyone

you don't really need a ball valve on anything but the siphon standpipe. However some put one on the open channel and then tune that with the siphon closed I think. However I would rather have no valve on the OC, because if it starts to operate on full siphon, then it will flush and gurgle loudly, alerting me to an issue. Otherwise you could theoretically never know the siphon line was clogged, and then if the OC clogs you have a problem. The point of this system is 'failsafe' so why set yourself up for failure

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2061389

And yes 1.5 for all 3 pipes. Don't reduce down, IIRC you may have a problem getting the upper pipe to purge all the air. Correct me if I am wrong anyone

you don't really need a ball valve on anything but the siphon standpipe. However some put one on the open channel and then tune that with the siphon closed I think. However I would rather have no valve on the OC, because if it starts to operate on full siphon, then it will flush and gurgle loudly, alerting me to an issue. Otherwise you could theoretically never know the siphon line was clogged, and then if the OC clogs you have a problem. The point of this system is 'failsafe' so why set yourself up for failure