Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

[Sacohen]

I've never done one of these and might be talking out of my A__, but how about taking a glass canopy backstrip like this (http://www.petmountain.com/product/...2-516017/perfecto-glass-canopy-backstrip.html) and place it over the edge of the wier and then level it.

 

[meegwell]

Wow such great feedback so soon! I have hope! On the flow, Im going to first see how fixing the kink in the flexi (or getting the right kind of flexi) does.

This canopy backstrip idea is great and I have a modified thought...I can get a piece of glass basically about the height and the lenth of the front panel of my c2c overflow, and silicone it to the inside of the box with the upper edge leveled...

 

[Sacohen]

This canopy backstrip idea is great and I have a modified thought...I can get a piece of glass basically about the height and the lenth of the front panel of my c2c overflow, and silicone it to the inside of the box with the upper edge leveled...

Even a piece of Acrylic from HD or Lowes you shouldn't need anything really thick since it will be glued to the main glass for the majority of it.

 

[cdrewferd]

So how would I run this on a 4' 120g that has dual overflows with a 1" and 3/4" pipe in each overflow?

 

[GROSSR]

cdrewferd : you mean swapping out what you have for a coast to coast overflow that was designed by BeanAnimal? or what Sacohen is referring to?

if you mean a coast to coast...you have 4 holes... Bean asks for 3. Your holes are on the bottom, c2c they are on the back. Nonetheless, holes.

off the top of my head. spitballing here :

build your c2c so your c2c drains into those standpipes. I guess you could have 2 emergency holes, one on each side. You would have to modify the overflows so the c2c sits on top of it.

You could close off the holes and re-drill. Just an idea.

rich

 

[HPballer76]

so i am planing my next tank and would really like to do a tank on the main level with a basement sump only problem is the sump can't be directly under the tank. would this drain system be able to handle going down about 7 feet horizontally over 19 feet to the room the sump can go in and then down another 6 into the sump? is there anyway for that to work or is it simply to far of a horizontal run?

 

[cdrewferd]

No, I mean using the 2 built in overflows that have 2 holes each. I'm thinking it's not really possible without attaching the overflows some how.

 

[uncleof6]

No, I mean using the 2 built in overflows that have 2 holes each. I'm thinking it's not really possible without attaching the overflows some how.

This has been discussed many times. Ideal is remove the overflows, and install a C2C. Next in line, is to bridge the overflows so they become the same body of water. Third in line, is siphon and open channel in one overflow, and dry emergency with return in the other. This shuts down 1 overflow, cuts your flow rate capacity, and reduces the skimming ability.

 

[meegwell]

so i am planing my next tank and would really like to do a tank on the main level with a basement sump only problem is the sump can't be directly under the tank. would this drain system be able to handle going down about 7 feet horizontally over 19 feet to the room the sump can go in and then down another 6 into the sump? is there anyway for that to work or is it simply to far of a horizontal run?

I have 6" of horizontal run and I was worried about that....actually re engineered to cut it back from 10". 19 feet of horizontal will likely cause issues here, particularly with establishing the siphon.

Can you somehow go on a 45 angle to cover the distance?

 

[uncleof6]

so i am planing my next tank and would really like to do a tank on the main level with a basement sump only problem is the sump can't be directly under the tank. would this drain system be able to handle going down about 7 feet horizontally over 19 feet to the room the sump can go in and then down another 6 into the sump? is there anyway for that to work or is it simply to far of a horizontal run?

Most likely it will air lock, and not get going. 45 it down, and it will probably start. With that much pipe, 32', plus fittings etc, despite the 13' drop, I would not expect the performance to be earth shattering. On the other end, that is a long run and is going to take a pretty stout pump, relatively speaking, to get past the friction loss.

 

[HPballer76]

I may be able to 45 it but i'm not sure if it will work I will have to remeasure. I have a reeflo barracuda that i was planning to use as a return pump. Originally was planning to have the sump in an unfinished basement directly under the tank but we have decided to finish the basement in the next couple of months so the sump won't work as I originally had planned.

 

[James77]

I'm starting up a 75 gallon for anemones and clownfish....could not help it with the $100 sale on 75 gallons near me, and I may have to buy another.

The weir in my 120 gallon is about 24" wide, 5.5" high, and approx 3" deep. I want as shallow a footprint as possible on my 75 gallon. I am using the standar 1" street elbows, but I sawed it in half and glued on a flat piece of PVC. Doing this allows me to have an internal weir that is only 1.75" deep. I will have no room to remove the elbows without cutting open the wier; however, I have not needed to access the elbows or remove them at all in over 3 years on my 120.

Not sure if its been done, just floating it out there for a lower profile option

 

[BeanAnimal]

I don't see a problem in a low flow situation, but you have in effect halved tha capacity of the standpipe

 

[uncleof6]

I'm starting up a 75 gallon for anemones and clownfish....could not help it with the $100 sale on 75 gallons near me, and I may have to buy another.

The weir in my 120 gallon is about 24" wide, 5.5" high, and approx 3" deep. I want as shallow a footprint as possible on my 75 gallon. I am using the standar 1" street elbows, but I sawed it in half and glued on a flat piece of PVC. Doing this allows me to have an internal weir that is only 1.75" deep. I will have no room to remove the elbows without cutting open the wier; however, I have not needed to access the elbows or remove them at all in over 3 years on my 120.

Not sure if its been done, just floating it out there for a lower profile option

Interesting idea. It is good that you have not had to remove the elbows in three years, however that is not the point. The point is, as soon as you say that, you will need to get the elbows out. Murphy's Law works that way. You have cut the intake area by 1/2, and that is going to be a restriction and affect the flow capacity, how much I don't want to guess, but think in terms of 1/2" pipe; it has also increased the risk of plugging by an order of magnitude. Since you will not be able to get the elbows out, or even get to them with your hand, without tearing the overflow out, I think you are asking for a problem, if it does plug. It won't flood, but you will still be hosed.

Although I don't see any drawback to reducing the width of the overflow inside the tank, other than already stated, I see absolutely no benefit to it either, in any terms. I would suggest that you follow the guidelines if putting the elbows inside the tank: be able to get your hand in the overflow, and be able to get the elbows out. If you are insistent about this narrow of an overflow, I would suggest you do an internal/external, and put the elbows outside the tank.

*EDIT* well bean covered the capacity issue.

 

[James77]

I don't see a problem in a low flow situation, but you have in effect halved tha capacity of the standpipe

Yeah, it is very low flow, I'm shooting for around 225 GPH through it, maybe 300. Being a street elbow, the wider part that I cut is about a third of an inch wider, so I still figur its less than half I would lose.

 

[James77]

Interesting idea. It is good that you have not had to remove the elbows in three years, however that is not the point. The point is, as soon as you say that, you will need to get the elbows out. Murphy's Law works that way. You have cut the intake area by 1/2, and that is going to be a restriction and affect the flow capacity, how much I don't want to guess, but think in terms of 1/2" pipe; it has also increased the risk of plugging by an order of magnitude. Since you will not be able to get the elbows out, or even get to them with your hand, without tearing the overflow out, I think you are asking for a problem, if it does plug. It won't flood, but you will still be hosed.

Although I don't see any drawback to reducing the width of the overflow inside the tank, other than already stated, I see absolutely no benefit to it either, in any terms. I would suggest that you follow the guidelines if putting the elbows inside the tank: be able to get your hand in the overflow, and be able to get the elbows out. If you are insistent about this narrow of an overflow, I would suggest you do an internal/external, and put the elbows outside the tank.

*EDIT* well bean covered the capacity issue.

Obviously it is a risk, but going on 3 years of zero problems with my current setup have me confident enough to try it. I doubt anything large enough to clog the drains would get past gutter guard. While the elbows won't be removable, they are also not going to be glued in either. Should I need to fish or manipulate something out of there I can twist the elbows upward.

My sole intent is just trying for a very minimal weir. If it fails....it fails, I've broken down and setup up enough tanks where honestly it is no real big deal. This is not a full blown SPS reef that can never be disturbed again. This is an anemone tank that I could quite easily drain and fix any catastrophic problems in about 1 hour in the extremely unlikely event anything should botch up. Thanks for the input though . This is just me trying something low profile. I would love an external boxx and will someday, but that would require some pretty serious carpentry work for a house I am most likely moving out of in 2-ish years.

 

[reefermad619]

@james: let us know how it works out. I can see this working for low flow tanks. I've been thinking of building a 40B for a QT. Those elbows would be all that's needed to keep the overflow as shallow as possible. Maybe for larger tanks just go one size bigger than you need and cut the elbow in half? Have you though about shortining the back end a little? I've made successful pvc connections with as little as 1/2" of overlap. It wasn't ideal, but it worked. I bet if you cut off some of the back, you could get the elbow out easily with maybe only adding 1/2" of depth of your overflow.

 

[James77]

Yeah I was going to do that as well, trim off half the male stem on the elbow....who knows I may just add 1/2" to the overflow to be able to get them out. I'll keep the thread posted on the overflow build part.

I'm not sure me cutting the elbow in half like that automatically halved the potential flow. The smaller diameter of the 90* street elbow is the 1" pipe. The larger female end that I halved is 1 5/16" ( before cutting) . So the area of the 1" pipe is .78 square inches, and the area of the cut part is .67 square inches.....so its only about 15% smaller than the 1" pipe is area wise. I have no idea if the intake shape or potential drag from the tighter elbow would come into play at all, but I can't imagine it being all that significant. But the open upturned drain may not handle water flowing into it as well.

Regardless, for lower flow and smaller tanks it could be an option. Even with adding 1/2" for the ability to remove the elbows would have me at only 2.25" front to back

 

[lookout888]

James77, That is a great idea. To maybe get more flow, see if any of your local stores has a 1'' to 1.5'' street 90' Then cut that in 1/2 or a little more. The will make it wider and maybe give you closer to the 1'' flow with the same 1.75" depth. Here is an example
http://flexpvc.com/cart/agora.cgi?cart_id=6001685.28738&product=PVC-Elbows-Reducing-90 Dont know if I am allowed to link to it.. so just google "406-211 Reducing 90 1.5 x 1"

 

[James77]

James77, That is a great idea. To maybe get more flow, see if any of your local stores has a 1'' to 1.5'' street 90' Then cut that in 1/2 or a little more. The will make it wider and maybe give you closer to the 1'' flow with the same 1.75" depth. Here is an example
http://flexpvc.com/cart/agora.cgi?cart_id=6001685.28738&product=PVC-Elbows-Reducing-90 Dont know if I am allowed to link to it.. so just google "406-211 Reducing 90 1.5 x 1"

Thanks . I did check my Lowes and they do not have that large a street elbow, though that woould work fantastic for higher flow setups. Even if you cut the large part of the street elbow to 1/3, it would still give more area that a 1" pipe while being less that 3/4" wide if Im thinking right....