Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

[picker]

> you say the holes, ideally, would be completely submerged,
> but others suggest that the water will reach a height of only mid-circle

The one that is more submerged, utilizing its fully wetted area should have the slowest and calmest flow. Why would one what to limit the water's use of the given area? More smaller holes totaling the same area would be easier to submerge and the weight of the water above should inhibit bubble formation. (hole idea to reduce noise)

> concerns that a 1" depth (front to back) is not sufficient for an internal-overflow box,

The flow rate inside a larger box should be slower but here is a 1" c2c with bulkhead in a "test" herbie configuration able to flow 1000gph side to side, but does have some bubbles from the fall. [6.8Gig movie]

 

[Chris2223]

Hi I am setting up a standard 75g with an external overflow box and understand how the setup works. My only question is, on the external box, how tall should it be? My plastic trim is abt 1 7/8" tall, so would I place the external box snug against the bottom of the trim? I am going to drill 6 holes for the water to pass thru with a 45mm ( 1" bulkhead bit) 3 3/4" centered from the top of the trim. Going to space holes 6" apart centered. My external box will be 40" long x 4-5" wide, I would like to know what everybody thinks about this setup? I have to order the glass before the end of this week so I would appreciate all your help. Thanks in advance for all your help!

 

[Dangerwill]

Hey guys, I am putting my overflow together this weekend, anybody have a suggestion on how long the 1 1/2 pvc between the slip adaptor/cap and the sanitary tee should be?

Same question on the part that goes into the bulkhead

Muchas gracias!

 

[Dangerwill]

oops double post

 

[adeebm]

Hi guys. I'm just about to pick up my bulkheads and start plumbing, but still have lots of questions. Can someone tell me if I'm on the right track with this? I've got a 180RR, dual overflows, drilled with a 1" and 3/4" bulkhead in each column. The sump will be in the basement with 8-9ft head to the base of the tank. Return pump is a reeflo dart/snapper hybrid, which should output 1000-1500gph to the top of the tank.

I want to plumb using bean's system but searching the forums has gotten mixed results on whether it works with dual overflows or not. I don't want to cut up the overflows, and here's how I'm thinking of plumbing

[O o] [o O]
1...2...3..4

1. 1" full siphon to sump, using all 1" sch 40 PVC
2. 3/4" Open drain using all 3/4" plumbing
3. 3/4" Emergency drain
4. 1" return, with 1.5" spa-flex from pump. Bushing just before bulkhead

Can someone comment on this approach? Also, will i have stagnant water issues in the second column, and if so, can I swap #2 and #3?

Thanks guys

--Adeeb

 

[picker]

by swapping 2 & 3 one can get alittle skimming on the second overflow, but you shouldn't let it flow too much as (2 * pi * (3/4) ^ 2) - pi * 1 ^ 2 isn't much over 0 (ratio diam math) or use your design and not have any skimming on the second overflow.

how are you going to raise the second overflow anyway? (required for both theory's)

how about a herbie design with both 3/4 lines restricted but common making a full siphon and a 1" return and 1" Emergency?

> 1000-1500gph
hmm, my compromise might require pump restriction if drop is less than 4 feet because the two full siphon lines restricted to .35" might not flow enough

 

[uncleof6]

Hi guys. I'm just about to pick up my bulkheads and start plumbing, but still have lots of questions. Can someone tell me if I'm on the right track with this? I've got a 180RR, dual overflows, drilled with a 1" and 3/4" bulkhead in each column. The sump will be in the basement with 8-9ft head to the base of the tank. Return pump is a reeflo dart/snapper hybrid, which should output 1000-1500gph to the top of the tank.

The head pressure is from the water level in the overflow, to the water level in the sump. This is strictly the static head. The total head will be greater. The total head is the sum of static lift, plus friction loss in the lengths of pipe, and fittings. Often pressure biased pumps are need to get up out of the basement.

I want to plumb using bean's system but searching the forums has gotten mixed results on whether it works with dual overflows or not. I don't want to cut up the overflows, and here's how I'm thinking of plumbing

[O o] [o O]
1...2...3..4

1. 1" full siphon to sump, using all 1" sch 40 PVC
2. 3/4" Open drain using all 3/4" plumbing
3. 3/4" Emergency drain
4. 1" return, with 1.5" spa-flex from pump. Bushing just before bulkhead

Can someone comment on this approach? Also, will i have stagnant water issues in the second column, and if so, can I swap #2 and #3?

Thanks guys

--Adeeb

Since the bulkhead is the limiting factor (size) you want to use the smallest diameter for the siphon line e.g. 3/4". Use the 1" bulkheads as dry emergency and open channel. I would advise using 1.25" pipe on the 1" bulkhead for the open channel. Both the syphon and open channel in the same overflow. The dry emergency and return (if you must) in the other. Since the return plumbing will be at a minimum of 1.5" it makes no sense to run the return through either a 1" bulkhead or a 3/4" bulkhead. Run it up over the back, and plug the spare 3/4" bulkhead. Fill the "dead" overflow to a couple inches below water line, with fine aragonite, and shoot some flow over it.

The problem you are going to have, is not with the plumbing necessarily. The overflows, may not handle the flow rate. You need 23" of linear length overflow without teeth for 1500 gph (an approximation--more would be better.) and you should be targeting 1800 gph, rather than dipping down to and guessing between 1000 - 1500 gph.

 

[adeebm]

Thanks for the replies. In that case, the head is 10' or so. The pump is a reeflo snapper/ dart hybrid and should handle 1850gph@10' so I'm good there. I guess the flow rate if the overflow will be a problem. That will force me to have a drain in each column? If I have the return over the top, what's the best configuration for me, without modification of the overflows?

--Adeeb

 

[uncleof6]

Thanks for the replies. In that case, the head is 10' or so. The pump is a reeflo snapper/ dart hybrid and should handle 1850gph@10' so I'm good there. I guess the flow rate if the overflow will be a problem. That will force me to have a drain in each column? If I have the return over the top, what's the best configuration for me, without modification of the overflows?

--Adeeb

Plan on 12' - 13' head, depending on how straight the run is up to the tank. Changing direction is going to change the parameters. Vertical lift is only part of the story. I have heard of basement systems, that end up at 42' of head loss, with a 14' vertical lift.

I have not come up with a satisfactory solution to the dual overflow problem yet, other than not buying these tanks. Most good solutions are going to involve modifications if not complete removal in some cases.

 

[BeanAnimal]

For ease, filling one of the overflows with sand and using it for a return and emergency standpipe works.

I am a big fan of the Oceans Motions wave makers. If that is out of the budget, then a simple single or split over the top return is not a bad choice.

 

[uncleof6]

Run it up over the back, and plug the spare 3/4" bulkhead. Fill the "dead" overflow to a couple inches below water line, with fine aragonite, and shoot some flow over it.

 

[uncleof6]

Hi I am setting up a standard 75g with an external overflow box and understand how the setup works. My only question is, on the external box how tall should it be? My plastic trim is abt 1 3/4" tall, so would I place the external box snug against the bottom of the trim? I am going to drill 4 holes for the water to pass thru with a 45mm ( 1" bulkhead bit) 3 3/4" centered from the top of the glass. Going to space holes 7.5" apart centered. My external box will be 36" long x 4-5" wide. Thanks for your help!

Chris,

Butt the top of the external box, against the bottom of the trim.

 

[meegwell]

Hey guys, I am putting my overflow together this weekend, anybody have a suggestion on how long the 1 1/2 pvc between the slip adaptor/cap and the sanitary tee should be?

Same question on the part that goes into the bulkhead

Muchas gracias!

Ive got a total of 4" between bulkhead and standard tee. No problems...it goes through a wall. The issue you run into is the same with any horizontal run...you run the risk of an air trap preventing the siphon from starting. I tried to minimize mine by running my down tubes from the tee set between the wall studs rather than out in the fish roon.

Im not sure if its related but one thing i've noticed is i have very little margin when it comes to down pipe submerged level (that is how deep the end of the full siphon is in the sump). When i was setting up, filling, refilling, etc i noticed it doesnt take the water level to get get too high in the sump for my main siphon to not work at all and the open channel handle it all. Once it lowers to under 2 or so inches it kicks in good.

Fwiw....

 

[G.O.T.O.]

coast to coast overflow

coast to coast overflow

where do i buy or how do i make a nice coast to coast overflow box like the one in the pitcures of the bean animals overflow system.

 

[jerpa]

Get the glass cut at any local shop and silicone it to the tank. Make sure it is level. It is quite simple.

 

[pfoxgrover]

I was wondering how to contruct one of these BA style overflows but split flow into my sump between the refugium and filter sections in a controllable manor.

I'm sure there is an answer in this forum but 210 pages is alot of reading.


Thanks,
-Paul

 

[uncleof6]

I was wondering how to contruct one of these BA style overflows but split flow into my sump between the refugium and filter sections in a controllable manor.

I'm sure there is an answer in this forum but 210 pages is alot of reading.


Thanks,
-Paul

Short answer, don't. Feed the fuge with a branch from the main return line.

 

[pfoxgrover]

Short answer, don't. Feed the fuge with a branch from the main return line.

Are you sure it won't work?
Your suggestion would add alot of watts to my plans

 

[Lavoisier]

Are you sure it won't work?
Your suggestion would add alot of watts to my plans

No, it actually shouldn't. You want a low flow into your refugium (100 to 150 gph) so it should not require much wattage at all (4 or 5 watts on a quality pump).

You do not want to risk your siphon not starting properly with a tee on the pipe. Your gain does not begin to warrant the risk to your system.

 

[BeanAnimal]

It is my opinion that most folks don't push enough flow through their refugia... I no longer have a fuge but am rather sure that the 300-500 gph through mine did nothing but allow it to become a detritus trap. If I were to do it again, it would be the full flow of the sump.