Has LED surpassed Halides?

[pleasants9]

Not by a long shot, check out the lfs's in your area to see if they are sneaking back their mh and t5s. Two of the top lfs here are, I've seen the issues with their tanks over the last couple of years. I think they found out what I found out, in the long run there is still something missing in leds. I've used every form of lighting, and leds gave me more nuisance than every other source combined. Brilliant marketing though...

That's a good point, I know of one LFS in the area that was using LED's on all their tanks 5 years ago, should go by and see how that is working out. I really appreciate everyone's input.

 

[Hentz]

The debate is really pointless.

Completely pointless and just continues and continues!! lol.

Its the exact same thing as the Ford vs. Chevy vs. Dodge debate.
All the trucks will tow and do what you want them too. They just each have their own pros and cons.

You are all right! With great and stable water parameters, any of these lights will do anything!!! :deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse:

 

[ca1ore]

That's a good point.

Is it? I'd argue LFS are just as likely to experience 'user error' as hobbyists - maybe more likely.

 

[ifarmer]

Not by a long shot, check out the lfs's in your area to see if they are sneaking back their mh and t5s. Two of the top lfs here are, I've seen the issues with their tanks over the last couple of years. I think they found out what I found out, in the long run there is still something missing in leds. I've used every form of lighting, and leds gave me more nuisance than every other source combined. Brilliant marketing though...

yeah, one of the LFS near where I live. They used to run MH, they switched the entire store to LED for 4-5 years. Last month I went there, i saw the entire store is now runing MH and T5. Their fish only tanks are the only that use led but that is for fish only tank for customers to come in to buy fish.

 

[ReefCowboy]

Double post

 

[ReefCowboy]

Funny thing is most of the guys here advocating against leds are found on Led threads, entertaining the possible switch from an older method...lol(not directed at anyone, please let's loosen up a bit )
It is best to say "it is not there yet" than go by all the reasons leds suck and end up getting them in a near future.

 

[Wazzel]

yeah, one of the LFS near where I live. They used to run MH, they switched the entire store to LED for 4-5 years. Last month I went there, i saw the entire store is now runing MH and T5. Their fish only tanks are the only that use led but that is for fish only tank for customers to come in to buy fish.

Just because a person runs a LFS does not mean they will be able to use all the technology available in the hobby.

Keep this in mind. If LEDs did not work at all then no one would be successfully using them. It really has gotten down to people trying to justify their preference at this point in time.

 

[ali1]

Just because a person runs a LFS does not mean they will be able to use all the technology available in the hobby.

Keep this in mind. If LEDs did not work at all then no one would be successfully using them. It really has gotten down to people trying to justify their preference at this point in time.

Agreed.

With that being said, LEDs are on the rise. Doesn't make sense to spend $600+ on LED fixtures, as version X comes out the next year to address bugs in the prior generation. Do some research, there's $200 fixtures sitting on top of beautiful reefs.

 

[cougareyes]

Philips has a new led system that uses a diffuser panel to spread the spectrum and balance the intensity throughout, which I find to be problematic with the leds presently being used. This is definitely a step in the right direction. So are the t5 leds, which again spreads the effect throughout. This spot lighting effect could be detrimental to some corals, I mean really how can 1 or 2 leds within a fixture spread evenly across your entire tank. Map it from above and you see peaks and valleys all over, with overlapping spectrum and areas void of certain spectrum.

And "user error". they include the most beautiful colors; many completely unnecessary, and many even problematic. Primarily too much red and too much yellow for a display tank.

If you are able to understand and address these 2 issues, then yeah leds will be great.

 

[gus6464]

Philips has a new led system that uses a diffuser panel to spread the spectrum and balance the intensity throughout, which I find to be problematic with the leds presently being used. This is definitely a step in the right direction. So are the t5 leds, which again spreads the effect throughout. This spot lighting effect could be detrimental to some corals, I mean really how can 1 or 2 leds within a fixture spread evenly across your entire tank. Map it from above and you see peaks and valleys all over, with overlapping spectrum and areas void of certain spectrum.

And "user error". they include the most beautiful colors; many completely unnecessary, and many even problematic. Primarily too much red and too much yellow for a display tank.

If you are able to understand and address these 2 issues, then yeah leds will be great.

Actually according to some the diffuser panel on the Philips is nothing but a gimmick. A plastic dome is the true breakthrough that we were all waiting for apparently.

 

[cougareyes]

Actually according to some the diffuser panel on the Philips is nothing but a gimmick. A plastic dome is the true breakthrough that we were all waiting for apparently.

I said it was a step in the right direction, to balance the spectrum and intensity of light across the entirety of your tank; rather than dozens of little peaks and valleys.

And I guess I trust what I see with my own eyes at an lfs, rather than what I hear from the internet experts. Both of the lfs I'm talking about that are now using t5s and mhs, in conjunction with leds; have absolutely gorgeous corals.

 

[Ou8me2]

It's a very good point. I bought a bunch of those LED night lights years ago. Advertised to last 25 years; what they didn't say was that 90% of the PAR was gone by the end of about 6 months. Comical.

I will say, though, that I have been running a RB Photon 32 for almost 3 1/2 years (at a max of 80%) and PAR with a meter is only down about 5%. I figure at that rate I'd replace them for better featured models before they fade appreciably.

That's good to know and yes I think if you can get 3+ years out of them and only lose 5% then that's not too bad.

You are right though and most likely by the time you need to replace the LED fixture there will be new tech out. I often wonder though and I know these Chinese black boxes are popular and how they compare to the high-end models in terms of lasting?

I'm not a cheap person and I will get what's best and within reason. However, you won't ever see me buying several thousand dollars worth of LED's for my tank. Unless I win the lottery of course. :lol2:

 

[jda]

Ca1lore's tank is a great example. Please look at it pretty hard as you consider your options. This is a great LED tank. Well done. It has some LPS, softies, a sweet squamosa clam (I think) and the SPS that can do quite well under LED.

Also, pay attention to what is not in there... maximas, croceas and the harder acropora that I can see. You will be more hard pressed to find really awesome tanks that keep these things under LED when they would not do better under lots of T5s or MH.

 

[dartier]

Actually according to some the diffuser panel on the Philips is nothing but a gimmick. A plastic dome is the true breakthrough that we were all waiting for apparently.

I disagree. The diffuser panel and light guides appear to contribute to a very even PAR distribution, and as BRS found, greatly reduce the caustic lines given off by the light. Just looking at tanks lit by the Coral Care units, in photos they look more like T5 tanks, flatter and more evenly lit, than typical LED tanks.

The trade off to the diffuser is a 20% loss in PAR.

Dennis

 

[jason2459]

I disagree. The diffuser panel and light guides appear to contribute to a very even PAR distribution, and as BRS found, greatly reduce the caustic lines given off by the light. Just looking at tanks lit by the Coral Care units, in photos they look more like T5 tanks, flatter and more evenly lit, than typical LED tanks.

The trade off to the diffuser is a 20% loss in PAR.

Dennis

How high up would those still need to be mounted to get the proper blending? I just switched back to led strip/bar lighting as I liked their ability to blend the lighting and even spread with great coverage length wise per strip vs. Led fixtures. With a few T5s retro fit in with several bars Im extremely happy again with the look. Shimmer is there but not to intense. T5s I just love their colors. No weird disco of colors.

I have a canopy that put the fixtures about 7 to 8 inches above the water. The scattering of different colors made an unnatural looking shimmer as I could see the reds, greens, blues, etc.

I would imagine even with that diffuser I'd still want the fixture up higher to get proper blending.

 

[ca1ore]

Ca1lore's tank is a great example. Please look at it pretty hard as you consider your options. This is a great LED tank. Well done. It has some LPS, softies, a sweet squamosa clam (I think) and the SPS that can do quite well under LED.

Also, pay attention to what is not in there... maximas, croceas and the harder acropora that I can see. You will be more hard pressed to find really awesome tanks that keep these things under LED when they would not do better under lots of T5s or MH.

Curious what you'd consider 'harder to keep'? I noted in my post that I cannot keep purple monster, but couldn't under MH either. The challenge with SPS in this tank is not so much the lighting as it is my choices of fish. Polyp extension is quite poor, though overall growth is good. In my frag tank, however, lit with the same combinations of LED, polyp extension is very good. I am very fond of my dwarf Angels, so ....

Right on the squamosa. It's large enough now that it mostly gets left alone. Whether I could keep the higher light requiring lama is a academic, nippers do them in. Have been able to keep and grow magnifica anemones under these same LEDs.

 

[gus6464]

I disagree. The diffuser panel and light guides appear to contribute to a very even PAR distribution, and as BRS found, greatly reduce the caustic lines given off by the light. Just looking at tanks lit by the Coral Care units, in photos they look more like T5 tanks, flatter and more evenly lit, than typical LED tanks.

The trade off to the diffuser is a 20% loss in PAR.

Dennis

I was being sarcastic in my remarks based on people's posts in the BRS thread. What's funny is those same people love LEDs.

I own a CoralCare. It puts out an even spread of light that is pretty much unmatched by any other unit out there. It looks like exactly like a T5 with a little added shimmer. No matter how high you hang it, visible color separation cannot be seen.

 

[dartier]

How high up would those still need to be mounted to get the proper blending? I just switched back to led strip/bar lighting as I liked their ability to blend the lighting and even spread with great coverage length wise per strip vs. Led fixtures. With a few T5s retro fit in with several bars Im extremely happy again with the look. Shimmer is there but not to intense. T5s I just love their colors. No weird disco of colors.

I have a canopy that put the fixtures about 7 to 8 inches above the water. The scattering of different colors made an unnatural looking shimmer as I could see the reds, greens, blues, etc.

I would imagine even with that diffuser I'd still want the fixture up higher to get proper blending.

I was just thinking, there is someone on here who imported a Coral Care and could provide actual feedback to answer this question ....

I was being sarcastic in my remarks based on people's posts in the BRS thread. What's funny is those same people love LEDs.

I own a CoralCare. It puts out an even spread of light that is pretty much unmatched by any other unit out there. It looks like exactly like a T5 with a little added shimmer. No matter how high you hang it, visible color separation cannot be seen.

.... oh right Gus6464! Clearly I did not detect your sarcasm ... I think you forgot to wrap it in </sarcasm> tags!


Dennis

 

[Ron Reefman]

It's a very good point. I bought a bunch of those LED night lights years ago. Advertised to last 25 years; what they didn't say was that 90% of the PAR was gone by the end of about 6 months. Comical.

I will say, though, that I have been running a RB Photon 32 for almost 3 1/2 years (at a max of 80%) and PAR with a meter is only down about 5%. I figure at that rate I'd replace them for better featured models before they fade appreciably.

I'm still running EverGrow IT2080 fixtures (yes, those pesky, cheap Chinese fixtures so many here seem to hate) and after 4 full years I can't say my PAR has dropped much if any. I still get 200 PAR at 22" deep with power set at 90% blue and 40% white. My new Reef Breeders Photon V2 fixtures may put out a bit more PAR at the same settings. But it's so close it's hard to till if it's the lights, the water quality or the angle of the probe in the water (it's super sensitive).

 

[Ron Reefman]

25 years selling aquarium lighting, I have the sales numbers and trends to prove it. Our MH sales are down 95% on MH since 2010.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

That's simply your specific company sales figures - the OP was asking if LEDs have surpassed MH "where they outperform the halides in regards to coral growth".

It's not a statistic, but it's evidence of the change that's taking place:

I just got a catalog from Drs Foster & Smith and it has 7 pages of led fixtures (roughly 25 fixtures) and 1 page of t5 fixtures (just 2) and no MH? Not one single MH fixture in the entire catalog.