Mysterious fish deaths are more common now (Flukes)

[cthetoy]

It would be very hard as the tank is large and so are the fish. I'm think the skimmer maybe the problem, but it's just a Remora and there is no cup in it. I do have some foam coming out of it but just a little, the bubbles are going back into the tank. When I first put in the Prazipro it bubble quite a bit. I'm think I need to just treat again and wait it out, as it does seem to take some time to get rid of the Flukes. It's not a short treatment and the Prazipro doesn't kill them in one shot, some seem to live for some time.

Prazipro does not kill flukes in one shot. I overdosed Prazipro by 5x its dosage (misread teaspoon as tablespoon) accidentally for 24 hours and still had flukes reappear after 2 months.

Most of your adult flukes should of been dead after 36 hours. Just the eggs may still survive. Most common with flukes are secondary infections or diseases such as ich and marine velvet. If your fish are still scratching and breathing heavily then your fish may have ich or velvet as well. Cupramine may be your best bet and could be used with Prazipro if you have a fish only tank. Fish also recover better, faster and quicker in a clean environment so perform numerous of water changes

I leave my skimmer off since it overflows like crazy with Prazipro. I add extra powerheads for increased circulation

 

[marrone]

I'm already treating with Copper but my fish don't have ich or velvet. I can see some of the Flukes on the fish body and one on an eye, this is after 3 days of treatment. The only thing I can thing of is that I lost some of the Prazipro when the skimmer was running, enough to cause a lot of the Flukes to still be a live. I plan on doing a water change tomorrow and treating again with Prazipro. I'm also going to shut down the skimmer and just run an extra power head for circulation.



I guess if the Prazipro kills most of the Flukes within 36 hours, except for the eggs, I would think the fish should be a lot better at this point.

 

[marrone]

Prazipro does not kill flukes in one shot. I overdosed Prazipro by 5x its dosage (misread teaspoon as tablespoon) accidentally for 24 hours and still had flukes reappear after 2 months.

Was it a problem treating at such a high level? I spoke with Hikari and I was told not to bump up the dosage. Last time I use it I did a water change and dose the whole dosage for the tank size. Hikari told me to run carbon for two hours, after the water change, and then dose the full amount.

 

[cthetoy]

Was it a problem treating at such a high level? I spoke with Hikari and I was told not to bump up the dosage. Last time I use it I did a water change and dose the whole dosage for the tank size. Hikari told me to run carbon for two hours, after the water change, and then dose the full amount.

I overdosed by accident. I noticed all my fish were not eating and lethargic the next morning so I performed a huge water change and ran large amount of carbon to get rid of the Prazipro. I was hoping my careless overdose mistake would kill all of the flukes in one shot but I was wrong since they came back again in 2 months.

On my second try 2 months later there were obvious flukes on my adult Imperator Angel's eye. Dosing at 70% Prazipro recommended strength I notice a few flukes peeling (not completely off) on the eyes after 1 hour. The next morning I dosed the rest of the 30% of Prazipro. A few flukes fell off completely on the Emperator's eye but a few more flukes were still peeling half way. By the third day the flukes were gone.

Your skimmer possibly removed most of your Prazipro

 

[marrone]

I'm think my skimmer may have removing some of the Prazipro, even without the cup in. I think the small amount of foam, and dirt, may have pulled out enough Prazipor to cause it to be too low. I would think after 3 1/2 days my fish should have been a lot better, which isn't the case, though they seemed a lot better after the first day.

Tonight I'm going to do a large water change, about 100gal out of 260gal tank, which is probably close to 230-240 net. I'm not going to run carbon, just add the full dose of Parzipro. I'm going to shut the skimmer down and run an extra power head. We'll see if that does the trick. I think if there is too much Prazipro in the tank it wouldn't kill the fish, just make them not want to eat.

 

[solitude127]

I wish I found this thread a few weeks ago.
I recently lost all my fish to what I believe was flukes. My question is that once flukes are in the system will they always be there? how long should I wait before adding another fish?

 

[billsreef]

Flukes are obligate parasites, and don't have much reserves to survive starvation or any prolonged cyst stages. So they can be starved out and any eggs from egg laying species hatched and starved in all of 4 weeks.

 

[fishyness]

Im pretty sure Ive found my answers here. Added a tang about 2 weeks ago and it died after about a week. Everyone was perfectly healthy til then. Last night my lionfish died, then my beloved porc puffer. All thats left now is a betta and a lunar wrasse, both of whom are showing no signs of anything. I havent done any treatment, one, this all happened so fast, and also wasnt really sure what I was dealing with here. All my params are in acceptable range (according to RC) except nitrates which are around 60. Does that fact that the 3 dead fish are scaleless have anything to do with their deaths?

 

[steelersfan]

I wish I found this thread a few weeks ago.
I recently lost all my fish to what I believe was flukes. My question is that once flukes are in the system will they always be there? how long should I wait before adding another fish?

I have asked the same question before. The answer that I received was there is no exact time period. If someone gives you a time period, they are merely taking a guess.

In my case, I left my tank fallow for 12 weeks. Perhaps that might be too long, but I wanted to play it safe. I have not had any issues with flukes after leaving the tank fallow. Now, I treat every fish with Prazi in quarantine, before they make it to the display tank.

 

[Aquarist007]

Flukes are obligate parasites, and don't have much reserves to survive starvation or any prolonged cyst stages. So they can be starved out and any eggs from egg laying species hatched and starved in all of 4 weeks.

which I guess is very similar to ich?

 

[Aquarist007]

Im pretty sure Ive found my answers here. Added a tang about 2 weeks ago and it died after about a week. Everyone was perfectly healthy til then. Last night my lionfish died, then my beloved porc puffer. All thats left now is a betta and a lunar wrasse, both of whom are showing no signs of anything. I havent done any treatment, one, this all happened so fast, and also wasnt really sure what I was dealing with here. All my params are in acceptable range (according to RC) except nitrates which are around 60. Does that fact that the 3 dead fish are scaleless have anything to do with their deaths?[/QUOTE

Too my knowledge all fish can carry parasites and not necessarily show signs of them. Whether they eventually become infected or die from them is more dependant on the strength of their immunity systems.

 

[billsreef]

Im pretty sure Ive found my answers here. Added a tang about 2 weeks ago and it died after about a week. Everyone was perfectly healthy til then. Last night my lionfish died, then my beloved porc puffer. All thats left now is a betta and a lunar wrasse, both of whom are showing no signs of anything. I havent done any treatment, one, this all happened so fast, and also wasnt really sure what I was dealing with here. All my params are in acceptable range (according to RC) except nitrates which are around 60. Does that fact that the 3 dead fish are scaleless have anything to do with their deaths?

That 2 week time frame is rather fast for flukes. I'd be more suspicious of Amyloodinium.

which I guess is very similar to ich?

Close enough in terms of the obligate parasite that can be starved out

Too my knowledge all fish can carry parasites and not necessarily show signs of them.

Correct.

Whether they eventually become infected or die from them is more dependant on the strength of their immunity systems.

In some cases the immunity can play a factor in low level ich loads. However, high parasite loads of ich can overwhelm a fish before it gets a chance to develop an immunity to that specific strain. Also some parasites such as flukes are not effected by a fishes immune system.

 

[fishyness]

thank you for the replies. Will my sea urchin be ok?

 

[billsreef]

Sea urchins aren't fish, so fish parasites won't effect them

 

[Aquarist007]

Sea urchins aren't fish, so fish parasites won't effect them

However they as can corals, other inverts and live rock, carry the parasites and introduce them into a display tank if not quarantined

I separate my fish from my corals, live rock and inverts that I keep for my clients. I keep everthing I purchase for a least two weeks in the two tanks for observation.

 

[fishyness]

What an awful sinking feeling. I noticed today my flame angel in the reef has not shown her face and mrs clown has some suspicious looking dust. HOW could this happen in 2 different tanks??? Well it dawned on me just about 5 min ago, since I dont use any equipment on both(nets, algae scrubber etc) Thursday nite when I got home lionfish had just died and he was gone, turns out hubby (not knowing) put him in a pitcher to take him outside, yes my fish pitcher I use to top off RO water for both tanks...do you think that could have spread it or maybe im just being paranoid cause the angel is missing... also the angel as is everthing in the reef tank, very healthy and have had them all about a year..could velvet take out a healthy fish that fast??

 

[billsreef]

Unfortunately yes, velvet can be that fast acting. That's the major problem with diagnosing it in time, it's often killed before it's notice It also can spread via shared equipment usage such as you just described, as well as aerosol transmission via any salt spray from breaking bubbles.

 

[fishyness]

Thank you for the info Bill, I can only hope someone else can benefit from my unfortunate mistake(s), I know I sure have.. Believe me its a pretty awful feeling knowing your beautiful, happy healthy fish suffered and died beacuse of what you did

 

[dnsfpl]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1831384

is my lion infected with flukes?

The obvious symptoms:

1) Fish twitching the head side to side once in a while like if wanted to shake something off his head.

2) Discolored blotches of skin (Most people think this is velvet or some bacterial infection and misdiagnose it with antibiotics)

3) Frayed fins or tail.

4) Sudden loss of appetite. Fish was fine yesterday but today it̢۪s not eating at all.

5) Cloudy eye(s)

6) Rapid breathing


should i do a 10 mins fw dip now?
thanks

 

[billsreef]

Based on that cloudy eye and other symptoms you mention, odds are very high that is indeed flukes. I would do a FW dip of least 1 minute, up to 10 tops. However, with lionfish be very, very careful. I like to use large clear plastic specimen containers (the ones the fish shop uses) to catch them from the tank. Place the container in area you can gently steer the fish to, use a net to guide the fish in, no hands Once the fish is in the container, keep the net over the opening to prevent escape or jumping out as you lift the container out. Once out, poor most all of the SW water out of the container and replace with your prepared FW. Lions usually tolerate FW dips very well, but if it gets overly hyper after at least 1 minute, you can go ahead and terminate the FW dip and replace the FW with tank water. If you get the snow globe effect in the FW dip, than the fish indeed has flukes.