OrionN
Moved on
You can get them here at DFS website
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produ...=pla&catargetid=530005150000113571&cadevice=c
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produ...=pla&catargetid=530005150000113571&cadevice=c
Protocol for using antibiotics to treat infected anemones ~Added to 7/30/14
- Thread starter OrionN
- Start date
CoralsAddiction
Active member
Based on the Scoring system on the first page of this thread, at what point does one start a treatment?
Amoo
Member
It's not completely black and white CA, it's more about the change in score you've noted. If you've noted a change of 1/2 points, probably no big deal. If you noticed a change of 3/4 points, probably time to think about treating. Also almost anything 6 or above I treat.
HTH.
While I do think a scoring system is useful, I have tended to take a somewhat simpler approach. If I have an anemone that fully deflates (not just a few tentacles) more that once - two days in a row, for example - I put it into treatment. My own personal experience with magnifica anemones is that if I get them into treatment quickly, I have a 100% survival rate (3 out of 3). If I wait too long, I have a 50% survival rate (2 out of 4). I had one years ago that survived without any treatment, and one that dies before I knew any better; but all the others I have kept required treatment, including a recent specimen that had already been treated by DD.
I purchased a red based H. Magnifica and put it into my DT. At the LFS it looked inflated, mouth closed and healthy. But it had just arrived the day before. Initially it looked the same in my tank but the whole anemone looked "empty". The way a car dealership arm flailing inflatable tube man would look. Inflated but like it had no substance to the anemone. I left it in my DT for a week on a wait and see. The first few days It looked like it was beginning to improve on its own and the anemone attached in a nice spot high up and great water flow. Then it began to regularly deflate for 20-30 mins about an hour before lights out on my DT. Otherwise looking healthy the rest of the day and throughout the night. (i didnt initially realize this until the anemone was in treatment but the deflation always occurred when I fed my fish, I would feed thawed frozen mysid, some LRS, and some frozen cylopeez. I usually fed after I got home in the evening so it was always around the same time. As soon as the food hit the water the anemone deflated. Thoughts on this?) My concern was that it would not improve on its own and I didnt want to wait until it started to melt. The mouth was never gaping or open, always closed and tight, but the tentacles would deflate and the anemone would shrink up. Ron Popeil is a good friend of mine and we traded pics back and forth on txt msgs. After some discussion we agreed that it would be best to treat.
I ordered Cipro online and waited for it to arrive as I spent days looking for sources locally and was not able to get anyone to listen to the crazy man who wanted antibiotics for an anemone. Once I got my Cipro I moved it to 10g QT and started treatment. I do 100% water change at end of day cycle with 1/2 500mg Cipro tablet. Tank has a heater, powerhead separated by egg crate. and a mesh top with a dual PC light. I am currently on Day 5 of treatment on my H. Magnifica. Since day 1 the anemone has not deflated. It looks healthy, inflated, attached to glass. My next question is how much longer should I continue treatment since it has not deflated again since beginning treatment. I was thinking of discontinuing Cipro after the 7th treatment and possibly moving back to display soon after. Any suggestions? I will try to upload some photos of my progress.
I ordered Cipro online and waited for it to arrive as I spent days looking for sources locally and was not able to get anyone to listen to the crazy man who wanted antibiotics for an anemone. Once I got my Cipro I moved it to 10g QT and started treatment. I do 100% water change at end of day cycle with 1/2 500mg Cipro tablet. Tank has a heater, powerhead separated by egg crate. and a mesh top with a dual PC light. I am currently on Day 5 of treatment on my H. Magnifica. Since day 1 the anemone has not deflated. It looks healthy, inflated, attached to glass. My next question is how much longer should I continue treatment since it has not deflated again since beginning treatment. I was thinking of discontinuing Cipro after the 7th treatment and possibly moving back to display soon after. Any suggestions? I will try to upload some photos of my progress.
D-Nak
Active member
Sounds to me like treatment worked. Any update? If you can observe it in the QT for a week or so, it'll allow you make an assessment of whether or not the treatment worked.
Treatment seems to have worked. Its now acclimated to the DT. Waited about 2 days after 7th dose. No signs of deflation since 1st treatment and looking very healthy. My main concern was how long to treat and how long to observe before returning to DT after 7th treatment given that the anemone had not deflated since day 1 and was looking healthy. I didnt want to move it too early and possibly have it relapse. Seems to be going well so far though.
Any advice for treatment of this scenario:
Currently have a mag in dedicated qt since 9/16. Treated with cipro for 5 days right off the bat. Nem has been deflating completely about once every three days lately. The odd part is the nem looks healthier and healthier as the days go by (with the complete deflation every third day or so). I'm defining healthier as stronger more solid stance and reduction in bleaching.
I can't decide if I should dose spectra. Have a clownfish in with the nem.
Currently have a mag in dedicated qt since 9/16. Treated with cipro for 5 days right off the bat. Nem has been deflating completely about once every three days lately. The odd part is the nem looks healthier and healthier as the days go by (with the complete deflation every third day or so). I'm defining healthier as stronger more solid stance and reduction in bleaching.
I can't decide if I should dose spectra. Have a clownfish in with the nem.
givemeajob
New member
I want to thank everyone on this thread for all the information. I have been treating two mags in a hospital tank for 10 days now. They were in my display for almost two weeks when I decided that it was time to treat them. They were still clinging to the rocks but were deflated more than inflated and ones mouth was gaping wide open. The tank is very mature, large (450 gallons), with plenty of light and random flows. All other livestock has been flourishing.
I just returned one to my display last night after he showed no signs of deflation for over 4 days. This morning he is huge although he moved onto the front glass which is not the best viewing spot so I'm hoping he at least moves to the sides.
I've left the other in the hospital tank for now (the one who's mouth was initially gaping), still treating with Cipro and keeping things constant. He looks better all the time but I'm not ready to put him back in the display just yet. He's not bleached but he just doesn't look quite there yet. I don't mind keeping him on the hospital tank and probably will for another week or so.
Bottom line, this treatment works as I'm sure these two mags would be dead by now. It also is a good conversation piece talking to people about how you are treating your marine life with antibiotics. It makes me sound smarter than I actually am.
Thanks everyone.
I just returned one to my display last night after he showed no signs of deflation for over 4 days. This morning he is huge although he moved onto the front glass which is not the best viewing spot so I'm hoping he at least moves to the sides.
I've left the other in the hospital tank for now (the one who's mouth was initially gaping), still treating with Cipro and keeping things constant. He looks better all the time but I'm not ready to put him back in the display just yet. He's not bleached but he just doesn't look quite there yet. I don't mind keeping him on the hospital tank and probably will for another week or so.
Bottom line, this treatment works as I'm sure these two mags would be dead by now. It also is a good conversation piece talking to people about how you are treating your marine life with antibiotics. It makes me sound smarter than I actually am.
Thanks everyone.
Got my answer in another thread
Reefvet
New member
Hah !
So you came back here to let us know you got an answer, but it didn't occur to you to say what it was.
Classic post. :beer:
marc price
Active member
FYI,
I used a PAR meter to test several of the commonly available at Lowes and Home Depot PAR-38 5000K LED's. The Philips 19.5watt 5000K PAR 38 LED has almost twice the PAR of all the others available at Home Depot and Lowes.
http://www.homedepot...m79Z15bZ1z0u18w
I have been doing well with all types of SPS combining the 5000K Philips with a Feit 450nm Blue PAR-38
http://www.feit.com/led-lamps/perfo...rmance_led/color_leds/color_led/par38-b-ledg5
There is also a 23Watt 6500K which is interesting however i didn't order one so don't know what the PAR will be - http://www.bulborama.com/LED-Light-...HT-INDUSTRIAL-GRADE-LED-LIGHT-BULB-p2444.html
skyrne_isk
Member
So as a practical question, what is the prevailing wisdom regarding infections that develop in the display tank? When an anemone develops an infection, not as a result of shipping but as a result of some pathology that manifested itself spontaneously in the display tank, what is the best route to clear pathogen from the display tank after treatment has occurred? One of my carpets that I've had for several years developed an infection as a result of a confluence of unlikely events (no new additions or water changes even):
I had been away from the tank for several days and while I was gone the carpet developed a bacterial infection. The best explanation that I can come up with is that while I was gone, a cylinder/ solenoid/probe Ca reactor malfunction caused excess CO2 to be dumped in the reaction chamber which created an alkalinity spike which in turn resulted in calcium carbonate precipitation to deposit in the one vortech that is in the tank (70G). This vortech pump effectively produces all of the flow for the tank. The low flow conditions in the tank over the course of several days caused a bacterial infection to manifest as the carpet went days with next to no flow. By the time I caught up to the anemone it was deflated, necrotic and near death. Cipro treatment has been quite effective in halting the tissue necrosis (even though I did take the liberty of injecting Cipro directly into the foot and to the siphonoglyphs) and the anemone is now recovered. I excised probably three golf balls worth of tissue that was necrotic from a carpet the size of a softball. Amazing recovery.
The concern now is that when adding the treated anemone back to the main tank, stress symptoms and posture were exhibited after 48 hours back in the main tank. Removing the treated carpet back to the treatment tank resulted in an immediate return to normal posture. This leads me to believe that the underlying bacterial pathogen is still present (or in higher than normal concentration) and and that this bacteria is going to have to be addressed before the carpet can be added back to the display.
As a fun side fact, I keep a secondary system that also houses a different gigantea that is filled only with water that is pulled out of the main display when water changes are performed (though this has stopped as of a week ago after the upstream system infection occurred ). As a result of this practice over time, this second tank is ran much dirtier than the display tank. This bacterial condition did not manifest itself in this tank, and in fact the water from this tank has been used as the treatment tank water source throughout the cipro treatment course. So at this point I am a little stuck on how to remediate the bacterial pathogen that developed in the main tank. It is clearly still present enough to be an irritant to the carpet that was just treated. Is maybe the solution simply waiting for the imbalance to correct itself? Keeping the treated carpet in treatment or in the second tank is definitely an option, but those daily 100% water changes are rough.
I had been away from the tank for several days and while I was gone the carpet developed a bacterial infection. The best explanation that I can come up with is that while I was gone, a cylinder/ solenoid/probe Ca reactor malfunction caused excess CO2 to be dumped in the reaction chamber which created an alkalinity spike which in turn resulted in calcium carbonate precipitation to deposit in the one vortech that is in the tank (70G). This vortech pump effectively produces all of the flow for the tank. The low flow conditions in the tank over the course of several days caused a bacterial infection to manifest as the carpet went days with next to no flow. By the time I caught up to the anemone it was deflated, necrotic and near death. Cipro treatment has been quite effective in halting the tissue necrosis (even though I did take the liberty of injecting Cipro directly into the foot and to the siphonoglyphs) and the anemone is now recovered. I excised probably three golf balls worth of tissue that was necrotic from a carpet the size of a softball. Amazing recovery.
The concern now is that when adding the treated anemone back to the main tank, stress symptoms and posture were exhibited after 48 hours back in the main tank. Removing the treated carpet back to the treatment tank resulted in an immediate return to normal posture. This leads me to believe that the underlying bacterial pathogen is still present (or in higher than normal concentration) and and that this bacteria is going to have to be addressed before the carpet can be added back to the display.
As a fun side fact, I keep a secondary system that also houses a different gigantea that is filled only with water that is pulled out of the main display when water changes are performed (though this has stopped as of a week ago after the upstream system infection occurred ). As a result of this practice over time, this second tank is ran much dirtier than the display tank. This bacterial condition did not manifest itself in this tank, and in fact the water from this tank has been used as the treatment tank water source throughout the cipro treatment course. So at this point I am a little stuck on how to remediate the bacterial pathogen that developed in the main tank. It is clearly still present enough to be an irritant to the carpet that was just treated. Is maybe the solution simply waiting for the imbalance to correct itself? Keeping the treated carpet in treatment or in the second tank is definitely an option, but those daily 100% water changes are rough.
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OrionN
Moved on
I think that in out tank there is always potential of having pathogens. Usually in a well run tank the pathogens level is low and the chance of infection is minimal. I think when there is a sick anemone, the concentration of pathogen is a lot higher. Basically the sick anemone is full of bacterial and when he deflated he dump all these pathogen out into the water.
I think once you removed the sick anemone from the tank the bacterial population should go back to normal. The competition of microorganism in the environment is extreme. Obligatory pathogen will not last long. I am sure you can put a healthy anemon back in your DT and he will be just fine. Providing that you got your tank back to optimal condition. I just do water change and reassess your equipments. Once your DT is back to normal it would just put the anemone back
BTW, I think I got my green Gigantea/Haddoni hybrid from you several years ago. He is doing great
I think once you removed the sick anemone from the tank the bacterial population should go back to normal. The competition of microorganism in the environment is extreme. Obligatory pathogen will not last long. I am sure you can put a healthy anemon back in your DT and he will be just fine. Providing that you got your tank back to optimal condition. I just do water change and reassess your equipments. Once your DT is back to normal it would just put the anemone back
BTW, I think I got my green Gigantea/Haddoni hybrid from you several years ago. He is doing great
OrionN
Moved on
I keep him in QT for a few days to make sure he is healthy. I can keep them in my QT indefinitely since it is set up for anemone, but as soon as I am sure that he is healthy then I can put him into my DT. You can tell, or at least I can, that an anemone is healthy within one week.
