Ron Reefman
Active member
Personally, I think they run cool enough that you shouldn't have any issues with heat, but the glass will cut the PAR values some (but not that much).
Reefbreeders/(Evergrow OEM) Fixtures D120/IT20** series
- Thread starter bhazard451
- Start date
Personally, I think they run cool enough that you shouldn't have any issues with heat, but the glass will cut the PAR values some (but not that much).
You're ok on the answers.
As for cyan LEDs, clay-boa is a good place to get them, they have decent cyans.
Any links on what to solder? I've seen a few things around, but something from the dealer would be appreciated. For those of us who have controllers already, linking the lights to them just makes sense.
Edit: In case it wasn't clear I was referring to question one about Apex controllers.
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adamhicks1988
New member
I have a 65g tank dem are 36x18x24 how many value fixtures do I need
droth335
New member
I would go with 2.
LexSkizzle
New member
Finally back from my cruise and my Photon 48 came in. Didn't waste any time before I put these bad boys up! :bounce3::bounce3: I need to play with the intensity of the color channels as the corals get acclimated in the next couple of weeks. Colors of my corals are looking good with these lights. The entire tank is lit up perfectly! No dark spots or shadowing. Let's see what these things can do over time.
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kipper1012
New member
Well I am patiently waiting on FedEx to deliver the fixture today for my wife's 56gallon Column tank
LexSkizzle
New member
Can anyone using the controllable photon series share there lighting channel ratios? I'am doing the 30 min. intervals and maxing out at 35b% and 30%w atm. as I am still acclimating the corals to the lights. I am hoping to reach a final max set point in the next couple of weeks. Just trying to figure out what channel ratios most are using with good growth on a mixed reef. I have the standard Photon 48 layout with 90 degree optics. Lights are hung 9" from the water. Thanks!
Ron Reefman
Active member
I have a different brand fixture (but made by the same company) and I do an 8 hour sunrise, 1 hour at 90% blue and 70% white and then an 8 hour sunset. But most of the day is much higher blue % than white %. In fact the first 2 hours and last 3 hours are only various power settings of only blue and no white.
If you are going to run a number of hours at some peak setting (I used to do that and it works fine) do as much blue as you can and only add as little white as you need to get to the overall color temp you want (like 10K, 14K or 20K from MH). More white than that does add PAR, but a lot of that PAR (about 50% IMHO) is in spectrum your corals need virtually none of (green, yellow, orange). The other 50% is a bit better than half blue (which is good) and a bit less than half red (which is good up to a point). But your corals and their zooxanthellae don't need too much red spectrum IMHO. So my recommendation is only run as much white as you need to get the look you want and not any more. And I'll bet your fixture has red and green leds which is even more reason to run the white channel as low as possible. IMHO, red and green leds aren't needed unless you have a 3:1 or 4:1 blue to white ratio, OR, if you keep your white channel turned down to the minimum you can and still get the overall look you want.
Blue is good for coral, but most of us aren't crazy about the windex look. White is mostly for our eyes and very little for the coral. And where we see white (because of the way our eyes work) the coral and zooxanthellae see some blue, some red, and some green, yellow and orange (which they don't need and may very well not even like).
If you are going to run a number of hours at some peak setting (I used to do that and it works fine) do as much blue as you can and only add as little white as you need to get to the overall color temp you want (like 10K, 14K or 20K from MH). More white than that does add PAR, but a lot of that PAR (about 50% IMHO) is in spectrum your corals need virtually none of (green, yellow, orange). The other 50% is a bit better than half blue (which is good) and a bit less than half red (which is good up to a point). But your corals and their zooxanthellae don't need too much red spectrum IMHO. So my recommendation is only run as much white as you need to get the look you want and not any more. And I'll bet your fixture has red and green leds which is even more reason to run the white channel as low as possible. IMHO, red and green leds aren't needed unless you have a 3:1 or 4:1 blue to white ratio, OR, if you keep your white channel turned down to the minimum you can and still get the overall look you want.
Blue is good for coral, but most of us aren't crazy about the windex look. White is mostly for our eyes and very little for the coral. And where we see white (because of the way our eyes work) the coral and zooxanthellae see some blue, some red, and some green, yellow and orange (which they don't need and may very well not even like).
LexSkizzle
New member
Hi Ron,
Thanks for the recommendations. My Photon48 doesn't have any greens, but it has four red leds. I have the most recent layout by reefbreeders. Personally, I prefer the bluer look but I didn't think that would get me the coral growth I would like.
If I am understanding you correctly, are you essentially saying that more blue is better for coral and overall coral growth? I was always under the impression that more white has more par and therefore, is better for coral growth, with respects to at least MHs and T5s. For example, I thought that MH in the 20k or actinic bulbs were predominantly more for aesthetic purposes, and yield minimal coral growth. Is it the opposite when it comes to LED's?
Thanks for the recommendations. My Photon48 doesn't have any greens, but it has four red leds. I have the most recent layout by reefbreeders. Personally, I prefer the bluer look but I didn't think that would get me the coral growth I would like.
If I am understanding you correctly, are you essentially saying that more blue is better for coral and overall coral growth? I was always under the impression that more white has more par and therefore, is better for coral growth, with respects to at least MHs and T5s. For example, I thought that MH in the 20k or actinic bulbs were predominantly more for aesthetic purposes, and yield minimal coral growth. Is it the opposite when it comes to LED's?
markster33139
New member
I too would like clarification on this Ron as you grabbed my attention with your last post. To clarify you are saying that the blue channel is actually better suited for coral growth and color, and therefore you would want to program your light fixture with a clear bias towards the blue channel
There are currently no LEDs that are true whites. Only yellow leds posing as whites. Corals don't need yellow light and most spectrums they need are found in the blues, reds, and violet leds. The current "white" leds are nothing more then "brighteners" that help us achieve a certain look. You actually don't need them at all.
Reef_Breeders
Sponsor
I am not sure what you are basing that statement off of. There are several pigments excited by the yellow spectrum, so neutral whites, which are somewhat heavy in yellow, are great for bringing out colors in corals. On the blues and violets, there is a ton, about 5 times more of that than any other light spectrum put out from the fixture, and that is with 12 neutral whites in a photon24. They are not neccessarily needed, but they make the corals look much better, and they make the tank look real, instead of a black light kind of look. But I agree, you could use just blues and violets, and grow corals.
moondoggy4
Team RC
how bout
how bout
How bout a 30 x 24 x 20 tank what would you recommend? Thanks in advance
how bout
How bout a 30 x 24 x 20 tank what would you recommend? Thanks in advance
Ron Reefman
Active member
Look at the color of light as it penetrates the water. Blue is the only color that gets very deep. Reds are gone in just a few meters and most corals are at least that deep. Then look at the spectrum of light used by the zooxanthellae in the coral (and by the coral pigments... sort of the corals sun tan lotion). The Chlorophyll a & c use way more blue spectrum than anything else. They do use some red as well, just not nearly as much, except for very shallow water corals (like 3 feet or less).
PAR isn't different based on color. A 3W led in 450nm blue is putting out just about the same amount of PAR as a 3W white led. And that white led isn't a yellow posing as a white. Odds are it's about 40-50% blue, 20%-30% red and the rest is green and other colors (yellow, orange, etc). Your eyes see a combination of red, green and blue (RGB) as white. Coral and it's zooxanthellae see it as red, green and blue because they don't have our eyes. So it doesn't take many white leds to wash out or cover over a lot of blue leds (to our eyes). So a tank can look white with 2/3rds or even 3/4ths of the leds being blue. That makes the coral happier. The white leds will add more PAR if you dial them up more, but it's green, yellow, orange and red which the coral only needs a small amount of.
I need to head off to work, but I'm willing to explain more and list some articles that explain better than I can and show graphs (but somebody else feel free to do it if you have the time).
Ron,
By this explanation, do you feel that any current LED fixture with only white LED's would grow corals? I do have several friends that only run blues and their corals grow fine.
I stand corrected. Some corals need some yellow light. We agree on everything else.
Ron Reefman
Active member
I guess I'm not making myself very clear.
"By this explanation, do you feel that any current LED fixture with only white LED's would grow corals?" Well, yes I think you could keep corals under just white leds and may even get some growth. This is what the very first led fixtures were back 5-7 years ago, right? But NO, I do NOT feel that is the way to go. In fact I say just about the opposite. Most fixture manufacturers use 1:1 or 2:1 blue to white. Mine are 3:1 and I wish I had gone 4:1 blue to white. It doesn't take much white light to get the small amount of red you want and it is also enough to 'wash out' most of the windex look. Even with a 3:1 ration, I run my blues at 90% and my white at 40% and end up with a 12K-14K overall color temp.
I'm also saying that unless you have a very heavy blue to white ratio, you don't need red and green leds. In a 1:1 or 2:1 fixture, the white leds add enough of any other color you want (given the white leds we use today). If you get to 3:1 or 4:1, you may not have enough red in the small number of white leds in your fixture. So a red led or 2 may be useful. And the greens will help keep the overall color from turning purple from a lot of blue and a littel red.
I'd wager that corals would do just fine in a 5:1 or even 6:1 blue to white ratio tank. But unless you like the windex look, you may not like it as much as the corals.
So I think we agree on a lot more than you thought. Right? :beer:
DavidinGA
Active member
Can all/any spectrum of light cause bleaching or is it only the white that causes the issues?
I've started to raise my blue channels up higher and higher on my Reefbreeders while keeping my whites fairly low by comparison and was wondering if most of the bleaching issues are from the White channels....?
I've started to raise my blue channels up higher and higher on my Reefbreeders while keeping my whites fairly low by comparison and was wondering if most of the bleaching issues are from the White channels....?
Reef_Breeders
Sponsor
Any light in excess will bleach corals.
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