Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

[TheFishMan65]

Yes, you could remove those. I think and Iam hoping Bean will correct me if I am wrong. But with an extrnal weir you could actually just have three vertical pipes. The first (siphon) would be very low adjust the wate level so it does not suck air. The open would then get just a little water and if the level went upit too would turn into a siphon. It does not meet the suggestion above that the open form a siphon after the emergency, but I am not sure tht is a requirement (Bean ?). Also it does not have some of the sound dampening, but if the flow is low enough should be ok (Q2 for Bean). Then finally the emergency would be a little higher.

It is my opinion that all the bends where a requirement for Beans internal weir, but hopefully someone will correct me if 3 vertical pipes would not work.

 

[stormrider27]

I would like to run all three pipes through the wall behind my tank so I can setup my sump and other equipment in the room behind my tank. Is there any drawback to running the section of 1" pipe that connects the bulkhead to the sanitary-tee trough the wall before the 1-1/2" vertical pipe? I am estimating that this will make the 1" horizontal pipe around 6 long before it hit the sanitary-tee and the overflow water goes vertical.

Thanks :beer:

 

[stormrider27]

Someone....anyone?

 

[RocketSurgeon]

Someone....anyone?

6 inches or 6 feet horizontal run before the downturn?

Also, I'm not sure you'll gain much, if anything, by enlarging to the 1.5" on the siphon line. It will still be restricted from the beginning, to 1" volume. The open channel may benefit from it.

 

[geaux xman]

is there any big benefit from going with a 900gph return pump(eheim1262) to a Blaster HY-7000(1800gph)? besides the obvious, more flow out the return pump, but i figure that can be provided by my PH.

150g, net 190g.

i understand certain skimmers can make use of the extra flow, while it could be a detriment to smaller ones.

rocket, which would you recommend between the 2 pumps?

 

[TheFishMan65]

storm,
I did not answer originally becuase I am not 100%. But IIRC the problem comes in creating the siphon. It will be a little harder.

The advantage of a larger pipe is for the open channel so there is more air to keep it quiet.

 

[RocketSurgeon]

rocket, which would you recommend between the 2 pumps?

Unfortunately, I'm not qualified to answer. Never heard anyone going wrong with an Eheim.

I use a mag 9.5 for my 75 gallon. I like to keep everything separate, so the rest of the system remains running during maintenance. I run a separate pump for my skimmer.

 

[stormrider27]

6 inches or 6 feet horizontal run before the downturn?

Also, I'm not sure you'll gain much, if anything, by enlarging to the 1.5" on the siphon line. It will still be restricted from the beginning, to 1" volume. The open channel may benefit from it.

RS,

About 6 inches; I tried to edit my post this morning when I saw if did not signify feet or inches but I the site wouldn't let me. Anyway, if you all think that is too long of a run before the vertical pipe perhaps I can angle the pipe downward towards the vertical pipe.

 

[TheFishMan65]

I think you should be fine, but if possible lower the siphon in relationship to the other 2 drains. That will make the siphon easier to start.

 

[stormrider27]

I think you should be fine, but if possible lower the siphon in relationship to the other 2 drains. That will make the siphon easier to start.

Thanks FishMan. How much lower do you think I need to have the siphon in relationship to the other 2 drains? By the way, I used to live in Vienna and my mother lives in Waterford which is just northwest of Leesburg.

 

[TheFishMan65]

I think Bean recommends 1/2 inch. Maybe an inch if you can do it. You might check his web site and see if there is a recommendation that is easier to find than rereading this thread .

 

[uncleof6]

On bean's website, he never recommends placing the open channel higher, nor was it suggested in his original thread (archived) on the first page where he describes how the system is to be set up. This suggestion came later, when a few were experiencing difficulties getting the siphon to start. Bean was very clear on the relative heights of each standpipe inlet, and the system will function properly when these guidelines are followed.

The two primary reasons for the siphon not starting are: an air leak in the siphon standpipe, or the drain line submerged too deep in the sump. Of late, within the last couple pages in fact, it has been found that some other "modifications" are causing issues. Two that are obvious are: The emergency standpipe inlet is too low, and/or the air line height is set too low, tripping the open channel to siphon, before the siphon is established in the "siphon" standpipe.

I would say that 99% -100% of issues getting the siphon to start, other than air leaks, are due to modifications to the basic design criteria, and there really should not be a reason to raise the inlet to the open channel. However the suggestion was a half inch or so

 

[TheFishMan65]

Thanks uncle perhaps you can anwer his original question:

I would like to run all three pipes through the wall behind my tank so I can setup my sump and other equipment in the room behind my tank. Is there any drawback to running the section of 1" pipe that connects the bulkhead to the sanitary-tee trough the wall before the 1-1/2" vertical pipe? I am estimating that this will make the 1" horizontal pipe around 6 [inches] long before it hit the sanitary-tee and the overflow water goes vertical.

Thanks :beer:

I was remembering that the extra horizontal caused problems with starting the siphon which I is why I recommended lowering the siphon channel.

 

[uncleof6]

The best performance is going to be coming out of the tank, to the tee, straight down for a ways, then angle down through the wall. Something along these lines:

I suspect that the OP is wanting the tank slammed against the wall, but I don't think in the long run that this is a good idea, as there are many reasons the need may arise to reach in behind the tank, so FWIW.

 

[stormrider27]

The best performance is going to be coming out of the tank, to the tee, straight down for a ways, then angle down through the wall. Something along these lines:

I suspect that the OP is wanting the tank slammed against the wall, but I don't think in the long run that this is a good idea, as there are many reasons the need may arise to reach in behind the tank, so FWIW.

Uncleof6 you are partially correct. I do want my tank close to the wall be not slammed right up next to it. I can run straight down then angle through the wall but my concern, since I have a hood over the tank, is getting to the gate valves if they are up by the sana-tees. Can I place the valves down by the sump after the pipes have gone through the wall like the in the picture you posted? Also, I thought all three pipes needed valves, in your drawing it looks like only the syphon pipe has a valve?

 

[RocketSurgeon]

Only the siphon requires a valve, and said valve should be near the sump when it is some distance away from display tank.

 

[TheFishMan65]

Jim, you realize of course that that sump will never function as designed

The first baffle will not control the height in the skimmer section since the second baffle is higher (at lest the way I see the picture). Also the water level will never be as shown. The final section would be sucked down by the pump and by way of the display tank fill up the first 2 sections.

Did you mean to have the return pulling from the middle section? Not trying to be critical, but a lot of noobies only read the last few pages so I am trying to clarify proper sump design. Thanks

 

[uncleof6]

Jim, you realize of course that that sump will never function as designed

The first baffle will not control the height in the skimmer section since the second baffle is higher (at lest the way I see the picture). Also the water level will never be as shown. The final section would be sucked down by the pump and by way of the display tank fill up the first 2 sections.

Did you mean to have the return pulling from the middle section? Not trying to be critical, but a lot of noobies only read the last few pages so I am trying to clarify proper sump design. Thanks

You think?

Even if I make the flow rate very high? ~2800 - 3000 gph?

Bummer. But I think you should check out melevsreef.com, because that is where the design came from. It works just fine.

 

[stormrider27]

Only the siphon requires a valve, and said valve should be near the sump when it is some distance away from display tank.

Hmmm, I am a little confused. Why did Bean have valves on all three pipes directly below the tees in the CAD drawing on his first post if we only need one down near the sump http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1310585 . Not trying to be argumentative. I just don't want to put more holes in my wall than I have to; especially holes that end up not being used.

 

[teesquare]

A lot of questions are being asked - that have been asked and answered - most more than once.

I understand it is a long thread - and no one wants to read it alll.
Bean, and Unc - what do you think about a BRIEF re-cap of all the important facts?
1. what works.
2. what does not

The "whys" and "why nots" are far too numerous to include in such.

Is it possible to create a sticky on this thread as such a tool ?

T