Silent and Failsafe Overflow System
- Thread starter JohnL
- Start date
Bent
I got nothin'
Well I'm draining it through the wall and it would be easier to put one of the stand pipes on the other end of the tank on the opposite side of the stud so I didn't have to Swiss cheese the header.
I was considering putting it on the opposite end of the tank and painting it black.
I can put them all together, but moving the emergency pipe would prevent me from snaking a bunch of pipe around and let it drain straight down to the sump.
I was considering putting it on the opposite end of the tank and painting it black.
I can put them all together, but moving the emergency pipe would prevent me from snaking a bunch of pipe around and let it drain straight down to the sump.
Placement of holes with 2" trim on tank?
Placement of holes with 2" trim on tank?
Finally getting to the point where I can drill holes...
The 2nd-hand system I bought has almost 2" trim around the top of the 75 gallon tank... How does that affect the placement of the holes? I'd like the overflow box to be as small as possible.
cheers,
David
Placement of holes with 2" trim on tank?
Finally getting to the point where I can drill holes...
The 2nd-hand system I bought has almost 2" trim around the top of the 75 gallon tank... How does that affect the placement of the holes? I'd like the overflow box to be as small as possible.
cheers,
David
Hi all.
Can someone help me out in understanding the use of u pipe?
I made a 18" dual box overflow for my 65gallon tank. The box that goes inside the tank has two 1 1/2 inch bulkheads and the out side has 3 1 inch bulkheads for the bean animal setup. For the open, partial, and failsafe pipe i was ony going to use 1" stright pipe.
Why do others use u pipe on the open channel and partial? Can i get around doing so?
Thanks for your input.
Can someone help me out in understanding the use of u pipe?
I made a 18" dual box overflow for my 65gallon tank. The box that goes inside the tank has two 1 1/2 inch bulkheads and the out side has 3 1 inch bulkheads for the bean animal setup. For the open, partial, and failsafe pipe i was ony going to use 1" stright pipe.
Why do others use u pipe on the open channel and partial? Can i get around doing so?
Thanks for your input.
Mrramsey
NEO Reefer
Well if I am understanding you correctly you made an external overflow box into a beananimal drain without drilling the tank?? If that is correct you just lost the failsafe aspect. There are no u tubes in a beananimal drain system.
Hi Mike,
I did drill the tank for two 1 1/2" bulkheads. This setup is much like ghost overflow. The internal box is a tad bit more than an 1" wide and has a weir. When the water enters into it, it then goes to the external box via the two 1 1/2 inch bulkheads. The external box has three 1" bulkheads drilled into the bottom of it.
I did drill the tank for two 1 1/2" bulkheads. This setup is much like ghost overflow. The internal box is a tad bit more than an 1" wide and has a weir. When the water enters into it, it then goes to the external box via the two 1 1/2 inch bulkheads. The external box has three 1" bulkheads drilled into the bottom of it.
The weir and magnet lids are not complete yet, but this will give you and idea.
My images
Thank you! That was the answer I was looking for. I'll get them in there.
uncleof6
Active member
It will be a bit tricky to get a 1" open channel to function quietly. Smallest practical size is 1.25" on a 1" bulkhead, and really, the bulkhead should be 1.25" as well.
I can't see what you have going on inside the external box, but if the front to back "support", I assume, interferes with the box being one body of water, even slightly, the system will not function properly.
I also think you are cutting the internal box too close. If the water fall hits the back wall of the tank, you are going to have problems with the setup. (Depends on head height above the weir.) I strongly discourage folks from cutting things so close, there really isn't any point to it.
Not sure your correct on this, but i'll let ya know when I'm done.
Check out all the dual box overflows using the bean overflow.
uncleof6
Active member
The smallest practical size for an open channel (aka durso standpipe) comes from the inventor of the durso: Richard Durso himself, direct quote. After years of dealing with these contraptions, I have come to the conclusion that he is correct.
I came up with the concept of an internal/external BA overflow, a couple of years ago, with a water pass through the back glass, rather than using the back of the tank as a "weir." What is it that I may not be correct about? There certainly are not very many of them actually in use...a lot of talk about it however.
Need some help. I will be drilling my 120g rimless this weekend for 1" bulkheads. I'm doing a internal glass overflow. Size will be 36"L x 4.5"D x 5.5"H. Not doing full 48". Leaving room for return. Which will be 1" bulkhead also. How far down from the top should I drill each hole for bean and the return? Also does the full siphon need to be lower than the partial?
uncleof6
Active member
Keywords search "hole spacing" yielded close to 100 hits on this site, in about 2 seconds...
Honestly, no one can really implement this drain system or understand how it really operates without doing some involved reading in this thread. Near the top of that long hit list, not surprisingly, is this thread, where your questions are asked and answered sometimes as often as 15 times a month. I know that most don't like to read, however, it is really the only way to learn, especially where complex physics and safety are involved.
Minimum safe distance is 2 3/4" down from the top of the glass to the hole center. However, this is going to be a bit tight, so you will want to go deeper to 3 1/4" - 3 1/2". You want a good 3/4" below the elbows, so you better measure things before you commit to the 5.5" H box. No reason to put the holes at different levels. You are doing yourself and the system a disservice by running the return through a bulkhead, and not running the overflow the full length of the tank. Aesthetics is the reason I assume, but that is not a good enough reason.
By reading, you will come to understand the logic, and often science, behind these concepts. Sure it will take you time to read, however it takes our time to answer questions over and over again...
Honestly, no one can really implement this drain system or understand how it really operates without doing some involved reading in this thread. Near the top of that long hit list, not surprisingly, is this thread, where your questions are asked and answered sometimes as often as 15 times a month. I know that most don't like to read, however, it is really the only way to learn, especially where complex physics and safety are involved.
Minimum safe distance is 2 3/4" down from the top of the glass to the hole center. However, this is going to be a bit tight, so you will want to go deeper to 3 1/4" - 3 1/2". You want a good 3/4" below the elbows, so you better measure things before you commit to the 5.5" H box. No reason to put the holes at different levels. You are doing yourself and the system a disservice by running the return through a bulkhead, and not running the overflow the full length of the tank. Aesthetics is the reason I assume, but that is not a good enough reason.
By reading, you will come to understand the logic, and often science, behind these concepts. Sure it will take you time to read, however it takes our time to answer questions over and over again...
Raoul5Duke
Active member
Just tested my system for the first time last night. I need to make some refinements, but for my first shot at it I was pretty happy. Probably hit somewhere between 2,700-3,000 GPH but it could have handled more. At that rate the overflow box itself was making most of the noise with only a 2-3" drop. I believe I can fix this by making the standpipes just a little taller.
Ok, So my 1" bulkheads are ok. But All of the standpipes should be built with 1.5" PVC fittings? I think I will also try to skip the slotted weir, but this will take more time planning.
Not a good choice of words on my part. What I should have said is that I hope your wrong.
Is there anything you thing I should do while I can before going any further?
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Thanks uncleof6. Appreciate the response. I have read thru most of this thread but it becomes overwhelming after awhile. Theres just so much info I kinda get lost as to what I should or should not do. So figuring if I shorten the height of the internal overflow to 4" so the elbows are about 3/4" inch off the bottom of the overflow should work well. Of course I need to measure it out just to be sure. Ive also reconsidered and I will be going full length on the weir and bringing the return line up over the top. Less holes to drill the better. Reading some more and it seems 1" from top of the overflow to top of the tank should be enough to allow plenty of surface skimming into the box and through the drains. And also leave the water level in the tank about an inch from the top. Which should suffice cuz I will be running 2 vortech mp40s.
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Today I completed the plumbing with 1" pvc all around except the return which is 3/4".
Filled the tank and turned on the pump.
I started with the siphon wide open and this caused a toilet affect. Water would build up in the outer overflow box and then it would flush (repeating)
I had to adjust the gate valve on the siphon to restrict the flow to the sump. Doing so caused the water level in the outer overflow box to rise and now the system runs perfect and quite.
I am currently using a Mag 9 that is a few years old. It only needs to push the water up the 3/4 return for a total of 3 1/2 feet.
Question: If I used a larger rated pump, would I be able to open the siphon up more or is it the opposite, smaller pump to allow for a fully open siphon?
Filled the tank and turned on the pump.
I started with the siphon wide open and this caused a toilet affect. Water would build up in the outer overflow box and then it would flush (repeating)
I had to adjust the gate valve on the siphon to restrict the flow to the sump. Doing so caused the water level in the outer overflow box to rise and now the system runs perfect and quite.
I am currently using a Mag 9 that is a few years old. It only needs to push the water up the 3/4 return for a total of 3 1/2 feet.
Question: If I used a larger rated pump, would I be able to open the siphon up more or is it the opposite, smaller pump to allow for a fully open siphon?
uncleof6
Active member
The water level is not involved with surface skimming. It is the length of the weir, in relation to the flow rate (head height above the weir) that affects surface skimming. E.G. at a given flow rate, the longer the weir, the thinner (less head height) the layer of water going over the weir, thus the better the surface skimming. That said, if the top of the weir is 4" down from the top of the tank, and the water level 1" down from the top of the tank, yeah, no surface skimming...
Weirs on rimmed tanks are 1.5" down from the top of the tank, even with the bottom of the trim on the outside of the tank. This leaves an inch below the top of the glass, not the top of the tank, while still hiding the waterline. Top of the glass is your "startline" not the top of the tank. On rimless tanks, the distance is usually 1" - 1.5" below the top of the glass, whichever you are most comfortable with.
Power heads are not complimentary or supplementary. They do not add to the return flow to obtain a larger number (such as with supplementary and complementary angles.) The power heads are adjunctive aids to the return flow, assisting in the dispersal of the returned water to all points of the tank. This is amongest the top five misinterpreted concepts in the hobby today, along with multiple pass systems vs. single pass systems.
How does surface agitation by powerheads interfere with surface skimming from weir?
I am planning to drill hole tops 2" from glass edge, should I prefer weir above or under this 2" Currently weir is level with top of holes, @2".
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