Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

[Lsufan]

Wave makers are ok. U have to get it tuned in by using the valve on the siphon drain. On your setup I would just put a strainer on the bulkhead or a short piece of pvc with a strainer on the siphon drain in the overflow box. Then I would set the open channel about 1 or 2" from the top overflow box. U use the valve on the siphon to set the water level in the overflow. U will want it to be where just a small amount of water goes in the open channel. Once u get to this point u will be able to tune it to where it is silent. Usually if it's not silent & everything is operating correctly it's because to much water is flowing in the open channel.
Don't glue the drains inside the overflow box so u can adjust the height of the drains if u find it needs it. U don't want the open channel to low in the box or u will have a waterfall entering the overflow which can get loud too.

 

[huseMN]

I am going to be setting up a 200+ gallon tank and will run the drain lines to a remote sump 20 feet away. Based on where I want to put the tank and the sump location I need to run the drain lines along a sunken floor and back up to the sump room. I will try and accomplish this by running them along the wall of the sunken floor and will need to build a box around them, then finish material will go on top (carpet). Sunken floor is about 9 inches lower.

My question... does anyone see an issue with only running the full siphon, secondary siphon and return line in the "box" and run the emergency/safety drain line to an empty tank below the 200+ galloon tank in the middle of my basement. I could then hook up a float or water alert in that tank that could be controlled by my Apex to shut off the return pump etc... I am trying to save a as much space as possible so the "box" I make around the 20' of drain lines to the sump is as inconspicuous as possible.

Thoughts?

 

[zachtos]

I would like to know if anyone feeds their siphon line to a device?

I want to use it to feed an algae turf scrubber so I can save wattage/pumps. It would drop about 2 feet down to the sump, then 90 degree into a 3 foot long pipe that has a 1/8" groove cut. This basically would create a open air waterfall curtain with the siphon line.

Will my siphon start up properly, and are there any problems you can see?

 

[LXXero]

heres my 120g nearly done. i went with an 18" ghost-overflow style box from modular marine, but i had them do it custom, 5x 1.5" bulkheads. normally he does 2" ones through the tank, but i decided to go 1.5" all around.

I ended up using one of those slip fit low profile strainers from lifegard and then i just used doubled 90s and drilled a hole in the corner of one of the 90s, and a short piece of PVC for the wet/trickle tube, and the emeregncy is just a straight pipe

the only other option woulda been to cut one of the bulkheads down so i could do the double-90 thing for both the siphon and the trickle, but i actually kinda like the strainer for the siphon, because it makes the overflow box drain completely when the system is powered down. I don't have any problems with venturis or anything, the strainer and the fact the double 90 is sitting on top of it, as long as the level is adjusted somewhere in the ball park, it's fine. the gate valve makes adjustment a breeze and i've never had a single issue so far

here is the main returns, full siphon is hard plumb in the back, trickle is the black spaflex

the emergency comes out into the return chamber on the other side

so far, the overflow box and the gate valve and all that, absolutely perfect. all works really great, and super dead silent. my bigger noise problem is actually the sump. first problem is that it's 1" intakes and not 1.5" so we had to reduce it down, not a huge problem but just an annoyance, and the 2nd bigger problem is that this proflex sump has those acrylic cylinders that the return pipes go into and then overflow through the filter socks, they're just not wide enough to handle the amount of flow I'm putting through without creating a huge jet of water out the top of the tube. I'm actually hoping that once the filter socks are a bit more clogged up from actual use, that it will gradually quiet itself down a bit as the water level in that chamber should rise. Since the noise is mostly in the sump, i may also try insulating the bottom of the tank stand a bit to make it even quieter, as well as reduce heat loss since all my heaters are down there. It's not nearly as bad as it was before I got the one plastic lid fixed up, either...

 

[Kirbuno]

Hey,
I am looking to do a 150G custom aquarium into an existing wall niche in my room tight up against the back of the niche. I wouldn't be able to get to the back of the tank once set up. Because of this I was wanting to order my tank with pre drilled holes in the bottom back with an internal weir. I was thinking two 2" holes for a 1-1/4" bulkheads and 2 at 1-3/4" for 1" bulkheads for return and full siphon ports. From what I've read this seems like it would be sufficient as I plan on tank fans as well. I wanted to keep the size of the bottom holes to a minimum because there are four holes!

I have looked thru these threads for the last 3 hours, and a couple more looking a the Herbie threads, I am sold on the BA version. Even so I have still only read a portion of these pages using searches for information, so I apologize if this question has already been answered, here goes;

I don't see anything about bottom of tank hole setup for the BA system for an on purpose tank setup. I see above some talk about an existing setup. Is an internal weir/drilling setup just not recommended? or will it just not work well? I assume the top of the system would work like a typical setup but just that the ports would be on the bottom of the tank weir and not in some external or internal overflow box, so it seem like theoretically that this would work just as well as an external overflow box.

However I've been wrong once before. Don't want to do that again! : )
Thanks,

 

[LXXero]

1 1/4" pvc isn't very common, i'd go with 1.5" that's what I did on my 120G in the photos above.

you can get bushings to reduce the bulkhead size, though. I'd sooner just make it 4x 1.5" bulkheads and call it a day, and you can reduce the 1.5" down to 1" with a bushing.

You probably don't find much about internal weir bean animal setups because you can't actually drill the bottom of most tanks, the bottom is tempered glass and it would shatter. On "reef ready" tanks, they drill the holes before they temper the glass, that's why you hear people talking about existing holes.

Only on custom built tanks can you have bottom holes drilled wherever/however you want, and that's why it's not a very common thing to see people doing, as many people are drilling an existing tank and not having one built from scratch.

The other thing about that is, most of those reef ready tanks have 2 separate weirs, usually with 1" and 3/4" bulkheads in each weir, so people will use the 1" for the emergency/trickle and the 3/4" for siphon and return, but you have to have this balancing act of putting the trickle on the opposing weir from the siphon, and then dialing the siphon back so that you still get water into the 2nd weir with the trickle line - to keep both weirs going at once....

If you're going custom, then you can put all 3 drains inside of a single, larger weir. That would make the whole thing much easier to tune and setup in general. However, you're pretty much talking custom all the way now, since nothing like that is really "off the shelf"

 

[Kirbuno]

New Tank

New Tank

LXXero,
Thanks for the reply, your explanation makes me feel better about the BA in an internal weir.

I decided on the 1.25" size because from what I've read, it allows 1.5 times the flow as a 1" but the fittings and the pipe for that matter are not so large and bulky. I am trying to save as much real estate in the tank as I can while trying to keep functionality up as well. The pipe size isn't so large but a even a 1-1/4" bulkhead requires a 2-3/8" hole, and the widest part of the fitting really pushes my weir out into the tank. You did convince me to upsize all of the holes to the same 1 1/4" size though.

Wanted to mention that only one of your uploaded photo's are showing, at least on my computer.

I think I uploaded the plan view of the aquarium just in case you or someone sees something I should be aware of before I get pricing. Not sure how to get the photo to show in the text area. Looks like it will be an attachment.

Best,

 

[LXXero]

my 1.5" bulkheads required a 62mm drillbit which is like 2.44", we just used 2.5", but the actual 62mm bits are not much bigger than 2 3/8 (2.375" vs 2.44"/62mm) so the difference to go to 1.5" isn't as big as you think, well, not unless you want to use schedule 80 bulkheads, then you need like a 3" bit, but that's totally unnecessary for the pressure levels we deal with, i wouldn't bother.

difference seems minor enough that it might not matter, but if you can find 1 1/4" pvc stuff, then by all means go for that, it's still better than 1" for sure. I'd have considered it for my 120 but i couldn't find any place to get 1 1/4" PVC other than ordering it online, dont think home depot or lowes has 1 1/4"

after looking at your plan, i do wonder if your bulkheads are actually too close together. I'd almost consider making the weir wider and adding more space between the bulkheads. Enough space that you can fit either a sideways T plus a 90, or a double 90, in between one or two of the pipes.

Like this basically, if your standpipes are too close, you wont be able to do this without it hitting them:
http://www.saltcorner.com/Articles/ArticlePics/durso1.jpg

Remember, you're gonna want some kinda double 90 setup or T+90 setup for the trickle line, you basically want the trickle line to be a durso standpipe like the one above. The full siphon you could cheat and just make the standpipe really short and put a strainer on it. You might even be able to fit the durso on top of the strainer if you get it all just right, that's like what I did:
http://www.xero.cc/fish/120_overflow_exterior2.jpg

see the double 90 is literally sitting on top of the strainer. that strainer on the bottom is my full siphon and the double-90 is my durso/trickle line, there's a tiny hole drilled in the corner of the other 90 that you can't see in this photo. this acts as the "air hose" or whatever that you'll often see people put on there.

the emergency needs the least room since it can be a straight pipe with nothing else.

i used a low profile strainer because my external weir is only 5" deep, but your weir is nearly tank height so if you make the siphon line sit pretty low in the weir, then you can use something like this even:

http://www.aquariumspecialty.com/me...39433887a97daa66f/s/l/slip-scree-strainer.jpg

then have the durso sit on top.

otherwise, you need to leave enough room so you can do something like this
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/tWMzmiU3wDY/maxresdefault.jpg

 

[Kirbuno]

Thanks again for the input LXXero.

I am planning on going with schedule 80 fitting for the bulkheads. I read that the schedule 40 has a record of occasional breakdowns over time, where the schedule 80 basically never breaks in these situations. I'll take the never having the experience of that happening.

I was planning on ordering the parts online, I do that a lot anyway. I'm thinking after reading your comments though that it would be a good idea to go ahead and order the parts and do a dry set up to make sure that the spacing of the holes works.

You mentioned that the primary siphon drain doesn't need the u shape on top and it would be just fine to leave it pointed upward with a screen. That makes sense, I wondered if the down turn was needed in this situation.

I seen this strainer on the Durso Standpipes site . It looks like it would be hard to plug up accidentally. Was thinking since I have so much height I would use this one.

Best,

 

[LXXero]

yeah, if you don't have enough space to do the "U" on both the siphon and the trickle, just do it on the trickle, and stick the trickle above the siphon (which, the siphon should then have a strainer on it). just dial the siphon back so you get a slight trickle and that should also hopefully be enough to prevent any venturi into it. This is not a very frequently discussed method to do the full siphon on a bean, but i've had great success with it, not sure why we don't see it more often (the double-U's with the 2nd having an airhose/being a durso is seen in most photos by far...)

i've read similar here or there, but i think it's mostly subjective. The real truth is, rubber seals can wear out over time. schedule 80 nor 40 are impervious to this. however, bottom drilled holes are definitely going to be taking more pressure than side drilled holes, it certainly can't hurt.

From what i've seen in practice, if you're going to get failures from anything on bulkheads, it's going to be from either over/under-tightening (not just the bulkhead itself, but also the fittings into the bulkhead, in the case of slipxthread or threadxthread bulkheads), or from badly drilled holes resulting in bad chips/gouges in the glass, in that case, using a schedule 80 bulkhead might help because they have a bigger flange, and so it might cover up a big chip around the hole, covering up the mistake, essentially.

yes you should try to dry fit for sure. and if you're using 1 1/4" make sure you can get all the fittings you need in that size. also if you're using thread, check all the correct threaded fittings are available in that exact size. i can tell you in my experience finding threading PVC fittings much above 3/4" in most local hardware stores is pretty uncommon, so i've ordered a fair amount of larger threaded stuff online.

that strainer looks awfully long is my only concern. as long as you dry fit it should be OK. Those ones from lifegard are pretty nice and they aren't as big, they even make the super slim flush ones that I went with, but you just need the regular ones.

 

[dmolavi]

I've had a BA overflow on my 40 breeder for about 9 months now, and it is fantastic. I went with the original plans as outlined on the BeanAnimal.com site (so I've got the ball valves and 3 of them). No biggie.

The one issue I'm having, and I'm wondering if it's common, is that upon restart, I never get a true full siphon through the full siphon line. I have to open it up all the way, then dial it back, which is a bit of a PITA. I'm wondering if this is because the full siphon and open channel (the one with the airline) are drilled at the same level in the back of the tank as shown in the original plans.

Has anyone else run into this, and if so, what have you done to make the system restart more hands-off? Obviously, I can't "undrill" the tank to bump the level of the open channel up. I don't think that drilling a small (or not so small) hole in the top of the open channel's elbow would do any good...it's already got an airline. Similarly, I don't think that shortening the length of the downturned portion of the elbow would do any good either.

Edit to add...I'll have to double check how far below the waterline the full siphon and open channel pipes are in the sump. Should they be the same depth, or should the full siphon be "just below" (1/4 inch maybe?) with the open channel a little deeper?

Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

 

[LXXero]

check out some of the discussion over in this therad, we're talking about nearly the same thing:

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2583363

I'd try to extend the siphon line further down the water using a small piece of PVC or etc....also you can drill the full siphon line to break the bubble in there, but it has to be drilled low as opposed to higher up as on the trickle line. i have a picture i attached in that other thread demonstrating what i mean....

another thing to double check is the depth of the pvc in the sump, you only want the pipes 1 - 2" under water max

 

[dmolavi]

check out some of the discussion over in this therad, we're talking about nearly the same thing:

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2583363

I'd try to extend the siphon line further down the water using a small piece of PVC or etc....also you can drill the full siphon line to break the bubble in there, but it has to be drilled low as opposed to higher up as on the trickle line. i have a picture i attached in that other thread demonstrating what i mean....

another thing to double check is the depth of the pvc in the sump, you only want the pipes 1 - 2" under water max

Thanks for the pointer here. Just to wrap my issue in this thread (I'll followup in the other if needed)...my open channel ends higher up than the full siphon, so I'll make a quick fix this weekend and hopefully that resolves it.

 

[Leanan]

I'm currently in the planning stages for a new nano tank - the Mr. Aqua 12 gallon long bookshelf tank with a 20 gallon sump. Is it ridiculous to consider doing a ghost overflow style internal coast to coast/external overflow with the 3 bean animal pipes? My original plan was to do this on the 60 gallon cube build I was working on, but I've recently decided to downsize and I'm not sure if my original plan will be overkill on this nano. If not, what diameter pipes would be best? Thanks a bunch for any feedback!

 

[LXXero]

I'm currently in the planning stages for a new nano tank - the Mr. Aqua 12 gallon long bookshelf tank with a 20 gallon sump. Is it ridiculous to consider doing a ghost overflow style internal coast to coast/external overflow with the 3 bean animal pipes? My original plan was to do this on the 60 gallon cube build I was working on, but I've recently decided to downsize and I'm not sure if my original plan will be overkill on this nano. If not, what diameter pipes would be best? Thanks a bunch for any feedback!

i mean, it'd work, but you could downsize the pipes big time. honestly the flow rate of a 12 gal tank is not going to be high enough to be that noisy in the first place. it might be overkill. i'm actually doing a 60 cube myself, i may or may not do a herbie/bean on it....its got 2x1" holes so i could totally do a herbie but may just use the tank's factory setup since the amount of flow i'd get from a 1" durso is probably enough for a 60g anyway....and the sump space and all that is much more limited on a smaller tank. it's really just about what you're trying to achieve flow wise / noise wise.

 

[OllieNZ]

I'm currently in the planning stages for a new nano tank - the Mr. Aqua 12 gallon long bookshelf tank with a 20 gallon sump. Is it ridiculous to consider doing a ghost overflow style internal coast to coast/external overflow with the 3 bean animal pipes? My original plan was to do this on the 60 gallon cube build I was working on, but I've recently decided to downsize and I'm not sure if my original plan will be overkill on this nano. If not, what diameter pipes would be best? Thanks a bunch for any feedback!

I did similar with my 6gal nano but my return pump didn't have enough flow. The box kept draining too quickly resulting in a flushing noise. I ended up blocking the open channel and running it as a herbie type drain.

 

[sleepydoc]

As good as it is, a beananimal system is really overkill for a nano tank. A herbie, or even a durso system will work quite well

 

[uncleof6]

As good as it is, a beananimal system is really overkill for a nano tank. A herbie, or even a durso system will work quite well

I would recommend a Durso type standpipe, with a decent flat weir overflow box. A nano just does not have the flow rates to require a high performance overflow/standpipe system. So good advice here. The herbie is overkill as well though.

 

[OllieNZ]

I would recommend a Durso type standpipe, with a decent flat weir overflow box. A nano just does not have the flow rates to require a high performance overflow/standpipe system. So good advice here. The herbie is overkill as well though.

I decided to go with safety, even the relatively small volumes involved with a nano can still make a divorce inducing mess.

 

[rhickman17]

Within the couple hundred pages here I think someone has shared whereabouts the bulkheads are drilled for this setup. I am drilling for 1" bulkheads on a 6' 125 gallon. From what I understand, 2.5" down from the inside lip of the trim?

The top of coast to coast overflow box should line up with the bottom of the trim around the outside of the tank?

The siphon elbow should be 3/4" from the bottom of the coast to coast box?

The top of the upturned emergency elbow should be 1" underneath the top of the coast to coast box?