Silent and Failsafe Overflow System
- Thread starter JohnL
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uncleof6
Active member
This thread, as well as the original thread are a must read for anyone wanting to do this system. There is so much information, that you miss--by only wanting to know bits and pieces. Do the homework.
uncleof6
Active member
NO that helps.
rrasco
New member
Check out post #4131 and beyond for some details about external overflows. There may be more information in this thread prior to that, but that is where I remember some posts that may benefit you.
You may want to also look at post #4274. Looks exactly like what you are describing, not sure if the sound issue was addressed after that though.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=19864307&postcount=4274
yousmellsfishy
New member
Here's my adaptation of the Bean Animal overflow. This is in a 55 gallon tank that will eventually be connected to an adjacent 40 breeder with a 3" square tube that allows the inhabitants to go from one tank to the other (More on that when I start my build thread). I started by drilling the tank with 4 1.75" holes. Next I siliconed in a sheet of glass on an angle to form the weir. The bottom of the sheet is siliconed to the back glass and the ends touch the sides of the tank forming a "V" section at the top back of the tank. It is a true coast to coast. Water flows over the top of the sheet of glass and through the 4 1.75" holes into the overflow box that I have on the outside of the tank. The overflow is drilled for the 3 Bean Animal drains on the bottom. Instead of creating the drains with the sanitary tees and tops that unscrew to allow for cleaning, I've just left the bits above the bulkheads unglued so that they can be removed to allow for drain cleaning. I've tested it for a few days and it works like a charm. It takes about 3 flushes of the overflow box after a restart before it reaches the silent mode. When it's running it is truly silent. You have to actually look to see the water moving to know if it's working and its moving 720 gallons/hour!
here's the weir
Here's the overflow box:
here's the weir
Here's the overflow box:
Firochromis
New member
Hi uncle, I'm doing my homework and reading the tread starting from 2008. :reading:
Meanwhile I need an information. As I said I have a 3/4" and 1.5" holes in the bottom of the tank, and they are both in a internal box. There is also two more 3/4" holes in the bottom but previous owner decided to not use them and covered them with glass. They are outside of the current internal flow. But if I choose this route I can built separate internal boxes to them. So, Does the Beananimal system be equally safe if run on two separated flowboxes? Like, one 3/4" siphon and 1.5" drain in one box; another 3/4" siphon in a separate box.
I appreciate the help I received and I'll try to ask less in the following days.
TheFishMan65
New member
Or try PVC and boiling water. I have done some very interesting tings that way.
troubles
troubles
I have the system up and running with exact plumbing from diagrams. System is on a 40 breeder with mag 7 return. at the heigth of my return thinking its pushing around 420 gph. Does not seem like the syphon ever gets started. It does run and is stable. But restarts scare me and seem to take forever to level out. was thinking at that low of a flow rate maybe I need to take the syphon down to 1 inch below the union. maybe that would help the syphon start or level out faster. Any help would be appreciated. Amazingly quiet, thanks for all the info.
troubles
I have the system up and running with exact plumbing from diagrams. System is on a 40 breeder with mag 7 return. at the heigth of my return thinking its pushing around 420 gph. Does not seem like the syphon ever gets started. It does run and is stable. But restarts scare me and seem to take forever to level out. was thinking at that low of a flow rate maybe I need to take the syphon down to 1 inch below the union. maybe that would help the syphon start or level out faster. Any help would be appreciated. Amazingly quiet, thanks for all the info.
Daimyo68
Active member
I had Beans drain system on my 50g with a true union ball valve, flawless and dead silent.
I just did this on a 75g and went with a gate valve this time for easier adjustment.
But, for some reason, it sounds like there is a small pocket of air in the gate valve itself. Every 5 minutes or so, I get what sounds like air purging/a knock sound?
Any ideas?
I've removed the pipe, made sure it is air tight, the gate valve itself is not faulty (loose gate, etc), and have not found the source of the noise. It pulls full siphon and I don't see any air bubbles at the exit of the pipe. It's been running for 2 days now, and there are no other problems.
Here's an image of the plumbing (All 3 pipes are attached to the stand and supported also, although in this image the siphon doesn't have the bracket on it):
I just did this on a 75g and went with a gate valve this time for easier adjustment.
But, for some reason, it sounds like there is a small pocket of air in the gate valve itself. Every 5 minutes or so, I get what sounds like air purging/a knock sound?
Any ideas?
I've removed the pipe, made sure it is air tight, the gate valve itself is not faulty (loose gate, etc), and have not found the source of the noise. It pulls full siphon and I don't see any air bubbles at the exit of the pipe. It's been running for 2 days now, and there are no other problems.
Here's an image of the plumbing (All 3 pipes are attached to the stand and supported also, although in this image the siphon doesn't have the bracket on it):
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uncleof6
Active member
Hi uncle, I'm doing my homework and reading the tread starting from 2008. :reading:
Meanwhile I need an information. As I said I have a 3/4" and 1.5" holes in the bottom of the tank, and they are both in a internal box. There is also two more 3/4" holes in the bottom but previous owner decided to not use them and covered them with glass. They are outside of the current internal flow. But if I choose this route I can built separate internal boxes to them. So, Does the Beananimal system be equally safe if run on two separated flowboxes? Like, one 3/4" siphon and 1.5" drain in one box; another 3/4" siphon in a separate box.
I appreciate the help I received and I'll try to ask less in the following days.
Works the same, basically, as long as the siphon and open channel are in the same box.
3/4" and 1.5" holes in one box: 3/4" bulkhead, using 1" pipe. (above and below the bulkhead) for the main siphon. 1.5" bulkhead using 1.25" - 1.5" open channel standpipe.
Second box (with two 3/4" holes) 1" dry emergency, on 3/4" bulkhead, and you can plug the other hole again.
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uncleof6
Active member
I had Beans drain system on my 50g with a true union ball valve, flawless and dead silent.
I just did this on a 75g and went with a gate valve this time for easier adjustment.
But, for some reason, it sounds like there is a small pocket of air in the gate valve itself. Every 5 minutes or so, I get what sounds like air purging/a knock sound?
Any ideas?
I've removed the pipe, made sure it is air tight, the gate valve itself is not faulty (loose gate, etc), and have not found the source of the noise. It pulls full siphon and I don't see any air bubbles at the exit of the pipe. It's been running for 2 days now, and there are no other problems.
Here's an image of the plumbing (All 3 pipes are attached to the stand and supported also, although in this image the siphon doesn't have the bracket on it):
I would guess, since you are not getting any air from the line, that the valve is closed too much, perhaps moving it lower towards the sump, would help. You do however, have a setup good for sucking in air, with the union, and threaded connections at the valve. Though if it were sucking air, there would be bubbles, to an extent, and possibly starting issues as well.
uncleof6
Active member
The flow rate would necessitate that the valve on the siphon be closed a considerable amount, equating perhaps to a 1" pipe, and you could get away with a 1" system, with a 1.25" open channel. W/low flow in a large pipe, it would make sense that it would take longer to purge the air, but again, everything being as it should be, the system should work fine.
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stability
stability
my question of wether the syphon has started stems from my thinking I would be able to feel more flow coming out the syphon as apposed to the open channel. After the system levels itself out (about 30 min.) I put my hand under the both pipes and can feel very little flow from either and definatley no differance in the two. If I understand what you are saying, as long as it levels out then a syphon has started? I have read that it can take a few min to level out but my system takes what seems to be alot longer than what I have seen people reporting in this thread. Both pipes terminate 1/2 inch under the water line. The open line is shorter horizontaly than the syphon by 3 inches. I would say the valve is 75-80% closed. The reason restarts scare me is that in the tuning process I did have the overflow kick in a little late and the water level in the return pump section of sump became too low shooting air bubbles into tank and not letting the system adjust itself . I think I solved that by running the minimum water level a little higher and dumping the emergancy directly into the return pump chamber. With taking so long to level out I am always afraid this could happen again. At this point I am just wondering if changing the syphon pipe to 1 inch and leaving the rest of the pipes the same may help level the system out quicker. I just dont like the 30 min it takes to level. Sorry for the long post and THANK YOU for the help.
stability
my question of wether the syphon has started stems from my thinking I would be able to feel more flow coming out the syphon as apposed to the open channel. After the system levels itself out (about 30 min.) I put my hand under the both pipes and can feel very little flow from either and definatley no differance in the two. If I understand what you are saying, as long as it levels out then a syphon has started? I have read that it can take a few min to level out but my system takes what seems to be alot longer than what I have seen people reporting in this thread. Both pipes terminate 1/2 inch under the water line. The open line is shorter horizontaly than the syphon by 3 inches. I would say the valve is 75-80% closed. The reason restarts scare me is that in the tuning process I did have the overflow kick in a little late and the water level in the return pump section of sump became too low shooting air bubbles into tank and not letting the system adjust itself . I think I solved that by running the minimum water level a little higher and dumping the emergancy directly into the return pump chamber. With taking so long to level out I am always afraid this could happen again. At this point I am just wondering if changing the syphon pipe to 1 inch and leaving the rest of the pipes the same may help level the system out quicker. I just dont like the 30 min it takes to level. Sorry for the long post and THANK YOU for the help.
uncleof6
Active member
30 minutes is way too long to settle, a few minutes is one thing, this is another. A picture of the system would be helpful. Sounds to me like a design problem, and/or adjustment, and a picture will save a great deal of typing. For instance, where is the location and level of the air intake tube for the open channel?
Just as a matter of course, it is common for the dry emergency to kick in at startup. If your return section ran down, you need to make other design changes to the system as well--such as a larger return section--as at some point this will come back to haunt you again.
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uncleof6
Active member
That does not surprise me on being almost full open, opening it all the way will not help much. The mag 12 needs a minimum of 1.5" inside diameter pipe, (per danner instructions) to get any flow out of it. Additionally, the tee in your return line is acting as a brick wall. Plus you are bleeding flow for the fuge as well.
adnup
New member
Silent fail safe for internal overflows? I'm sure it has been done
, I'm also sure there are a million posts in this thread and I'm getting dizzy trying to find one. :headwally:
Can someone point me to an example of Beans overflow used on an internal (through the bottom glass) overflow?
I have a 120 with 4 x 1" bulkheads
Thanks :spin2:
, I'm also sure there are a million posts in this thread and I'm getting dizzy trying to find one. :headwally:
Can someone point me to an example of Beans overflow used on an internal (through the bottom glass) overflow?
I have a 120 with 4 x 1" bulkheads
Thanks :spin2:
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