Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15042113#post15042113 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by teesquare
Puzzling.................
I know building code - and I find that well...un-believable.Not that I am saying you are not telling the truth - I just find it so bizarre as - again, building code requires that these are PVC - since the rest of the drainage and vent system are plumbed in PVC.
Did you look at the link I posted earlier? I wonder if they are referred to as something other than sanitary tees in your area?
Well - I get a surprise in life occasionally. As long as it is not in my shorts I am o.k.:D
Just trying to help guys, hope you did not think I was brow-beating anyone. I get frustrated with the help atmany of the H.D. and Lowe's stores. It is amazing how little some of them know.
And - occasionally you find a really knowledgeable person......
T
Click to expand...

I have given up on asking for help since HD and Lowes mostly hire inept people with maybe one per dept. that actually know something. Believe me, I know what I am looking for and where to find it. The fact of it is that it is simply not there. It is clear that you are familiar with building codes in your area, but do you really know the codes in Portland, OR? Not attacking, just saying that, while there may be an organization dedicated to creating building codes, the ICC, it is ultimately up to the states to decide which codes to adopt and enact as law.

Either way, thanks for your help, but once again, there are no PVC sanitary tees in the HDs and Lowes within about ten miles of my house.

I have found what I need through a local plumbing supplier and they have branches around the country. Might help some of you out too.

www.harringtonplastics.com
 
my applogies, posted that reply before I read further to where you had already realized what I was saying.

No harm meant.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15044362#post15044362 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jb61264
I am in the middle of building my failsafe overflow...have all the plumbling ready to go except the John Guest connector...which I am ordering from http://www.waterfilterstore.net/pi010822s.asp

My question is how does one drill the top of the endcap to create a threaded hole that this fitting will screw into? or am I looking at the wrong type of John Guest connector and perhaps I need to be looking at one that is a "slip" style (if they even make one)?
Click to expand...

With a 7/16" drill bit, and a drill motor. Use a 1/4" NPT tap, that you can no longer get in store at home depot. Lowes has one however. Interestingly, you cannot get them in store at sears either. That is the right fitting to get, and yes there is a quality difference between what is avail at HD, and the JG fittings. And no HD does not have JG fittings. Just imported knock offs.

Jim
 
luv051-
I am just glad you found them - and I learned something too:
Portland has lower standards for plumbing requirements than North Carolina! Surprise!!!!
Crap happens - and at 1/4 bubble fall...it hopefully goes downhill!:rollface: :rollface: :rollface:
T
 
it seems to me that most of the west coast has lower building code standars than the east coast. Not sure why...but I had a friend building a house in Boston, and I was shocked to hear some of the stringent codes he had to deal with. Drove the price of his house up too.
 
Check out the calculators link on the home page. Its on the left side. It will give you a linear overflow minimum based on your desired flow rate.
 
So my tank build (which includes a silent/failsafe overflow) is coming along well....drilled my first tank ever and had good results on all three holes. Here is a picture of my overflow box installed with the silent/failsafe setup sitting in place.

176257drilled-with-overflow-insta.jpg


I have two questions that I would like some input on please.

1. I think I may have not made my overflow box "deep" enough (it is 4" deep) and am wondering if I might have a problem with the sheet of water flowing into the box flowing into my upturned elbow...there is exactly 1/2" of clearance between the edge of the overflow box and the edge of the upturned elbow...I wasn't sure how thin the sheet of water would be flowing into the box and how deep it would spill into the box (ie...will it hug the inside of the overflow box?)

2. Since my sump is the same length as my tank (sump is a 55, tank is a 75)...the section of my sump that the tank will overflow into is on the same side as my plumbing. I'd like to have my upturned elbow be as is pictured above and have its pipe plumbed to the return section of my sump...does anyone see any problem with this? The two overflows with downturned elbows will flow into my overflow section of my sump. My sump from right to left is overflow with skimmer/return with Mag18/refugium fed from T in return.

Thanks for any feedback.
 
Does anybody know what configuration I would have to install to keep up with 5" of head pressure an a Reeflo Barracuda?

I did the original system (1 open standpipe, 1 siphon, and 1 emergency) but it obviously won't keep up with this new pump.

I tested the system by turning the emergency into a full siphon to do some plumbing/ flow testing. The drains are able to keep up using this configuration... once the siphons are established and the pump throttle is opened fully it is barely able to keep up, but runs for my testing purposes.

If the power is cycled off, then on, the rush of water back up to the tank will quickly overflow the tank before the siphons (including the conversion of the open standpipe to a full siphon due to water level) are able to establish.

What I need to know what I need to add to the current setup of 1 emergency, 1 open standpipe, and 1 full siphon (using the 1" bulkhead/ 1.5" piping in the original plan) to make this work.

My thoughts are adding an additional emergengy to prevent the overflow until the siphons can "catch" and adding another full siphon to handle the massive flow requirements, but I'm truly in need of an expert opinion here.

Thanks,
Joe
 
Joe,

Can you upsize what is already there? Adding a second siphon and second open channel (or emergency) will work, but does add complexity.
 
jb61

1) the 1/2" clearance should be fine. The sheet of water will just cascade down the back of the weir.

2) You can have the emergency standpipe dump anywhere you like :)
 
Unfortuately, the size is not negotiable at this point.

What kind of complexity are we talking about? Do you thing that adding 1 of each will be able to keep up with the Baracuda and not overflow on restart?

Thanks for the quick response,
Joe
 
Joe, adding the extra siphon should greatly increase the capacity. By your tests you appear to be confident that the (2) siphons will handle the flow. To keep the system "fail-safe" the emergency overflows need to be able to handle the full flow as well, so yes you will need to have (2) to match the siphon capacity. That in turn should allow the system to start without flooding (in theory).

The complexity is added in the failure modes. That is, the number of ways the system can fail (or fail-safe) and the number of variables that can affect system stability.

There are a few folks here that are using the system with extra siphons and open/emergency drains with success.
 
BeanAnimal , I have installed your over flow system , on my tank , and love it . Actually two very good friends did the work . I must give credit to adnup , and GlassReef , for the excellent job they did . The system is almost silent , but I'm having a problem with the height of the water in the over flow fluctuating a little . I believe it is due to me having an OM four way , on my return . When the water level drops , I can hear the water running over the weir . I would like to know , has anyone else mentioned having this problem ? Thank you
Ted
 
I run a squirt on a closed loop and don't have a problem. Do the level fluctuations corrolate to the port switching intervals on the OM? I have not heard anybody mention the problem.

So let me get this straight...

The overflow stays silent, but you can hear the water splash over the weir during the fluctuations? If that is the case, then we can try a few things... I guess the easiest would be to slit a length of vinyl tubing and slip it over the edge of the weir, in effect rounding off and creating a curved profile for the water to follow. If that works, then we can brainstorm on more permanent means of creating the profile.

If it is in fact the standpipes that are making the noise, then we can try a few things to adjust the system. What size return pump? How long is the weir?
 
i am going to use this method on a 40 breeder, should i just go coast to coast 36" or cut it down to 20"?
 
BeanAnimal, The standpipes are not the problem . The water falling into the overflow box is the problem . When I unplug the OM four way , at the right time , the fluctuations stop . I don't have any power heads in my tank , the only flow I have is from the four way . I don't have the Bucks for a Tunze PH set up .


Ted
 
okay bean im a little confused here......im putting this overflow on my new tank im building in a thread somewhere around here lol......anyways from your web page and the exploded view of the stand pipe you show a 1.25 to 1 slip street el. going into the 1" bulkhead now i went and got all the plumbing aready and was playing with it and the street el. does not just slip into the bulkhead like your diagram shows do i put a piece of 1"pvc in there for the connection??? or get a 3/4" to 1" street el????? or get a bigger bulkhead????lol... im confused......tia. for any help.....also what width and depth overflow box is recommemnded for this set up???? i was planning on running it the entire 8ft of the tank if possible for best surface skimming...
 
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