Top Reason Jebao wavemakers stop working and a super easy FIX for them!!!

slief said:
Great info David.



Yea, I would refer to it as a bushing as well but the manufacturers often refer to them as bearings. The Askoll motor blocks have a similar bushing in the block a at the base of the impeller which they too refer to as a bearing.

The idea is that this bearing or bushing or what ever you want to call it serves is to center and support the impeller at the base of the shaft below the magnet. The impeller shaft spins within the ceramic bushing. The tolerance is tight but just loose enough to not cause any friction. Calcium and in some cases even slime build up will cause friction between the shaft and the ceramic bushing. Because the magnets on these pumps are on the small/weak side, friction will lead to the pumps impeller stalling or seizing and in some cases premature failure of the motor block due to added load on the block.

The silicone tubing is more slick than the ceramic and allows for the shaft to spin easier. It's also more resistant to calcium buildup. The only real downside is that it's not as durable as ceramic but it's also not as sensitive to and prone to issues as mentioned above. The ceramic bushings are fine if the bearings are cleaned in vinegar regularly. This is why many people clean these pumps monthly and is also the reason why many people often report reduced flow after a month or so with these pumps. A little bit of buildup on the ceramic bushing and the impeller won't rotate as easily. I don't think this is as much due to the bushing being made from ceramic as it is due to both the impeller shaft and the bushing being made of ceramic. The combination of both create two opposing surfaces that are more prone to buildup. This is why higher end pumps include stainless or titanium shafts and use different materials to support the shaft at the base. Askoll uses a ceramic bushing but migrated many years back to stainless shafts. Tunze for example uses a titanium shaft and silicone to support as opposed to ceramic.

That said, this isn't the first time that I heard of using the silicone tubing in place of the ceramic bushing on these pumps. I will have to pass this along to some local people that I know with these in their tank. In fact, I may be taking a trip to a friends house myself to help him with this one so he knows that to do. It makes perfect sense that this could help reduce stalling and other issues.
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C'mon self, I expect much more from you.

The pump has ceramic bearings. If anything can be called a bushing it is the clear plastic piece that the bearing slides into. The reason this pump has issues is not because of the bearing material. It's because it was poorly designed. If the bearings get hot, calcium builds up. Ever heard of an anti lime loop? Eheim pumps have ceramic bearings and they run virtually forever with little to no maintenance. Ceramic is a great product for bearings and shafts as there is no wear because both surfaces have the same hardness and one cannot wear at the other. The famous Askoll that you speak of was never designed to run in corrosive salt water so the bearings were never that good. When Fluval asked them to redesign the pump for salt, guess what the first thing they changed.... That's right the UPGRADED to ceramic bearings with ceramic shafts!

Tunzes that I think you are referring to don't have the same design as the magnet is not attached to the shaft. Effectively the magnet is the bearing itself. This is referring to the stream pumps that have a shaft also pump designs like the old Maxijets. The ones that don't there is a bearing in the back and one at the top of the magnet to insure that the rotor stays centered in the well. Basically if the shaft spins, there is most likely (I want to say always but I might be forgetting a particular design in the late hours) a bearing or two.
 
gcarroll said:
C'mon self, I expect much more from you.

The pump has ceramic bearings. If anything can be called a bushing it is the clear plastic piece that the bearing slides into. The reason this pump has issues is not because of the bearing material. It's because it was poorly designed. If the bearings get hot, calcium builds up. Ever heard of an anti lime loop? Eheim pumps have ceramic bearings and they run virtually forever with little to no maintenance. Ceramic is a great product for bearings and shafts as there is no wear because both surfaces have the same hardness and one cannot wear at the other. The famous Askoll that you speak of was never designed to run in corrosive salt water so the bearings were never that good. When Fluval asked them to redesign the pump for salt, guess what the first thing they changed.... That's right the UPGRADED to ceramic bearings with ceramic shafts!

Tunzes that I think you are referring to don't have the same design as the magnet is not attached to the shaft. Effectively the magnet is the bearing itself. This is referring to the stream pumps that have a shaft also pump designs like the old Maxijets. The ones that don't there is a bearing in the back and one at the top of the magnet to insure that the rotor stays centered in the well. Basically if the shaft spins, there is most likely (I want to say always but I might be forgetting a particular design in the late hours) a bearing or two.
Click to expand...

Bushing, bearing, whatever. Normally I refer to them as bearings but that's because they are always referred to them that way by RE and in the case of this thread, I called them both. Personally, since they don't spin and don't have races in them that rotate seperately, they always seemed more like a bushing to me. I do however understand your point but it's kind of irrelevant because we all know what was being discussed in this thread. And for the record, I never suggested the reason these pumps have problems is because of the bearing material. Hopefully that wasn't directed towards me. I wasn't even going to go there because that wasn't the purpose of this thread & I am familiar enough with these pumps to know their short comings.

Yes, the Tunze Stream impellers ( and blocks for that matter) are vastly different. Unlike the Jebao in which the magnet is fixed to the shaft, the Tunze magnets spin on the shaft and the prop is attached to the magnet. As you noted, the blue silicone end pieces on the Tunze shafts simply center the shaft or dampen it as the shaft dosn't spin. I went back to edit my post and it was too late and I got side tracked with a movie.

Regarding the Askoll blocks, you're saying that the ceramic shafts were an upgrade over the stainless ones? If so, you learn something new every day and I stand to be corrected. Some of the old Askolls had the ceramic shafts if memory serves me correctly and they were prone to breaking from what I recall. Then again, I ran Askoll based blocks for years and never once had an issue with the bearings in those pumps despite having the metal shafts but as you noted they did have the anti line bypass/AKB as they were RE models. I did however clean the pumps every 4 months or so and removed the bearings and cleaned those too. That said, I am very well aware of the purpose of the AKB. So yes, I am very familiar with the the anti lime bypass and it's purpose. None the less, I think we got off course but thanks for the insight Greg. :thumbsup:
 
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Sorry I came off as harsh! I just want everyone to use the right terms as it will be helpful in the future when discussing pump design or problems.

You are correct in noting that a downside of the ceramic bearing and shaft can be broken. The upside is that it rarely happens.
 
So do you all believe it would be better to use soft silicone air hose or the standard lee's pet store stuff?
 
Nice thanks for this! I have a WP-25 laying around that I noticed had the same exact problem but didn't of doing something like this.
 
Well being an Industrial Maintenance tech for years. Many motors use bushings for "bearings"
They will always fail due to the flexing of the motor shaft. In this case the motor impeller will cause the issue. Bearings are generally used in motors that have to spin at high speeds with lots of torque.
 
reefwiser said:
Well being an Industrial Maintenance tech for years. Many motors use bushings for "bearings"
They will always fail due to the flexing of the motor shaft. In this case the motor impeller will cause the issue. Bearings are generally used in motors that have to spin at high speeds with lots of torque.
Click to expand...

At least there is another gear head here that feels my pain !
Haaaa !!!
 
reefwiser said:
Well being an Industrial Maintenance tech for years. Many motors use bushings for "bearings"
They will always fail due to the flexing of the motor shaft. In this case the motor impeller will cause the issue. Bearings are generally used in motors that have to spin at high speeds with lots of torque.
Click to expand...
Given your background... What are you thoughts on the airline tube mod?
 
new pumps should be modded ?

new pumps should be modded ?

DavidinGA said:
I've ran through enough of these pumps to know without a shadow of a doubt that the ceramic piece is a huge flaw and it will fail. So I am doing the mod on brand new pumps as I've found no down sides...
Click to expand...

so you think I should mod my pumps,?? I have just purchased the rw 15, and the 60 ?? mod before I put them in my tank ?
 
SkullV said:
So do you believe it would be better to use soft silicone air hose or the standard lee's pet store stuff?
Click to expand...
I'm not familiar with the Lee's pet store stuff. I've come across super soft airline hosing and the more common semi-rigid stuff and I would definitely recommend the semi-rigid kind. You want something that is solid enough to hold its form and not be easily bent or squished.
 
I may have to try this. I bought a new wp 40 for mixing saltwater. Used it 3 times for a total of 3 days and now the pos won't start.
 
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